红迪讨论: 西方人真的认为汉语听起来令人不悦吗？

RealEmperorofMankind
The West is a pretty broad category - you can find a Westerner who believes anything

西方是一个非常宽泛的类别——你能找到相信任何事情的西方人。

Dickcheese_McDoogles
I do not espouse the beliefs I'm about to describe, I speak Mandarin and I think it's a beautiful language. That being said:
Lots of westerners, or at least americans, think that tonal languages in general can sound grating. I was fanboying over Mandarin to a friend of mine who just did not find it as sonorous as I did and I asked him why.
He said it sounds like the tone of speech an English speaker will "put on" to deliberately connote someone who is being annoying.
"He was going ON↘and↗ON↘and↗ON↘and he↗WOULD↘n't shut↗UP!!"
I personally think it sounds gorgeous and very smooth to the ear, particularly Mandarin with the way that it does not have any plosive or "hard" final consonants.

我不认同，我接下来要描述我的看法，我会说普通话并且认为它是一种美丽的语言。
不过：很多西方人，或者至少美国人，认为声调语言总体上听起来刺耳。我曾经对一个朋友狂热地吹捧普通话，他却觉得没有我听起来的那么悦耳，我问他为什么。

他说它听起来像英语使用者故意“装”出来的语调，来表示某人很烦人。
“他一直在说个不停，声调上上下下，不闭嘴！！”

我个人觉得它听起来很华丽，而且非常顺耳，尤其是普通话，因为它没有任何爆破音或“硬”的尾辅音。

cooquet
Very interesting point, I think you're totally right that much of the (unfortunate!) distaste for Chinese accents probably comes down to tones. Even though English has some grammatical tone, it's mostly used to communicate emotion/vibe, and it's so hard to stop hearing it that way. It reminds me a lot of when people are put off by sign language facial expressions. They're a bit exaggerated and serve a grammatical purpose, but to hearing folks it can give off a theatrical/coming on too strong type of impression, kinda like how your friend hears Mandarin.

非常有趣的观点，我觉得你完全正确，对中文口音的（不幸的！）反感很大程度上可能归结于声调。尽管英语有一些语法声调，但它主要用于传达情感/氛围，而且很难做到不那样说，这让我想起人们对手语和面部表情的反感，它们有点夸张并服务于语法目的，但对听力正常的人来说可能会给人一种戏剧化/太强势的印象，就像你朋友听普通话那样。

caketaster
I don't like the sound of Mandarin but I do like Thai, which is also tonal

我不喜欢普通话的声音，但我喜欢泰语，它也是声调语言。

heavymetalmug666
I was not a big fan of Mandarin when I heard it being spoken, but I started learning about it (languages fascinate me), the more I learned the more I appreciated it. That applies to all the languages ive dabbled in. In high school I was mistakenly signed up for Japanese, stuck with it for 3 years. Sadly the local community college does not offer Mandarin.

我刚听到普通话时并不喜欢，但开始学习它（语言让我着迷）后，越学越欣赏它。这适用于我接触过的所有语言，高中的时候我被错误地报名学习日语，坚持了3年。可惜当地社区学院不提供普通话课程。

Lightingway
Yeah I'm starting to find questions asking about "western people" a bit weird, cause that's dozens of countries with hundreds of millions, if not a billion people depending how you define it.

是的，我开始觉得问关于“西方人”的问题有点奇怪，因为那是几十个国家，数亿人，如果按某些定义甚至是十亿人。

Amalganiss
It goes the same the other way, too. "Eastern Philosophy", "African" and "Asian", boiling down innumerable cultures down to a single arbitrary defining line. It turns out, we're all a lot moe diverse than just the continents we were born on .

反过来也一样。“东方哲学”、“非洲”和“亚洲”，把无数文化浓缩成一条任意的界线。事实证明，我们都比我们出生的那块大陆要多样得多。

Mobile_Roll2197
'east Asian' is probably the broadest category that's useful, because due to China's historical influence Greater China, Korea, Japan and maybe Vietnam do share a lot of cultural similarities. Not just due to Confucianism, but for example Vietnam more or less marks the Southern border of Mahayana Buddhism.

“东亚”可能是最有用的最广义类别，因为由于中国的历史影响，大中华、韩国、日本，也许还有越南确实共享很多文化相似性。不仅是因为儒家思想，比如越南或多或少是大乘佛教的南部边界。

netinpanetin
Just like saying “Asians” or “Black people”.

就像说“亚洲人”或“黑人”一样。

Chathamization
Even more so is when people ask what "foreigners" think.

更甚的是当人们问“外国人”怎么想的时候。

baninabear
Also want to point out that the account that posted the original tweet is a known troll that posts wild takes about games for engagement bait. It may be that user's opinion, but like you said the West is a really big place with all sorts of beliefs.

我还想指出，发布原推文的账号是个知名的喷子，为了吸引互动而发布关于游戏的疯狂观点。这可能是那个用户的意见，但就像你说的，西方是一个非常大的地方，有各种各样的信念。

pichunb
Woah, you mean people are not monoliths?

哇，你是说人们不是铁板一块？

Brilliant-Business71
That’s perfectly said and I’m gonna borrow that.

说得太好了，我要借用这句话。

IEC21
It depends - any language can sound pleasant or unpleasant depending on the context and style of speech.
English is my native language but it can be pretty annoying to listen to people screaming and arguing with each other.
Likewise people think German is an ugly language, but it's because they are always imagining a Hitler speech - in reality German is quite nice sounding.

这取决于——任何语言听起来悦耳或难听都取决于语境和说话风格。

英语是我的母语，但听人们互相尖叫争吵会非常烦人。

同样，人们认为德语是丑陋的语言，但那是因为他们总是想象希特勒的演讲——实际上德语听起来相当不错。

chemical7068
Yeah I heard normal german convos at the buck of the bus + that clip of a German kid going "my mom got me cola & I'm playing roblox, yippee" and it's very normal

是的，我在公交车后排听过正常的德语对话 + 那个德国小孩说“我妈妈给我买了可乐，我在玩罗布乐思游戏，耶！”的剪辑，听起来非常正常。

Ray3335
The german yippee kid sounds so funny and always makes me smile when I hear them lol

那个德国“耶！”小孩听起来太搞笑了，每次听到都让我微笑，哈哈。

Spainstateofmind
Wie cool ist das bitte?!

这也太酷了吧？！

BradfordGalt
in reality German is quite nice sounding
Thank you! I've been saying this for years. If you ever actually speak with a German in German, it's quite a gentle language.

实际上德语听起来相当不错。
谢谢！我已经说了好几年了。如果你真的用德语和德国人交谈，它是一种相当温和的语言。

Ankiset
Germán is beautiful wish I could fully dedicate time to be fluent in it, sadly I think Chinese is the only right choice it seems for a third language xD

德语很美，希望我能完全投入时间流利地掌握它，可惜我觉得中文似乎是第三语言唯一正确的选择。

-TRlNlTY-
The more I learned German, the better it sounded to me. I really like it.

我学德语越多，它听起来就越好，我真的很喜欢它。

Senior-Book-6729
I'm Polish so I was forced to learn German for like 9 years (no shade to the language, I just didn't click with it and would rather choose something else if given the chance) and yeah people don't realize how soft sounding it is. I remember when it was a meme to make fun of butterfly being SCHMETTERLING in German when it's such a baby sounding word if you actually pronounce it correctly

我是波兰人，所以被迫学了大约9年德语（不是说这个语言不好，我只是和它没感觉，如果有机会我宁愿选别的），是的，人们没有意识到它听起来有多柔软。我记得曾经有个梗是嘲笑德语里蝴蝶是SCHMETTERLING，但如果你正确发音，它其实是个听起来很婴儿气的词。

ClaudioMoravit0
Hard agree. The voice of Florian Schneider clearly changed my mind on it, German can definitely sound great

强烈同意。Florian Schneider的声音显然改变了我对它的看法，德语绝对可以听起来很棒。

Western_Bison5676
People think of the German “ch” like “Bach” sound when they say German is harsh but a lot of the time the German “ch” is pronounced like a softer “sh” like in “licht”. On the other hand, people say French sounds really romantic but the French “r” occurs a lot more frequently than a hard German “ch”.

人们说德语刺耳时想到的是德语的“ch”像“Bach”的声音，但很多时候德语的“ch”发音更像柔和的“sh”，比如“licht”。另一方面，人们说法语听起来很浪漫，但法语的“r”出现频率远高于硬的德语“ch”。

SuccotashRemote223
My supervisor is German and I heard her talking on the phone in German and it completely changed my mind about German, her language sounded so nice and soft. It felt like I could almost understand her

我的主管是德国人，我听到她用德语打电话，完全改变了我对德语的看法，她说的语言听起来那么好听和柔软。我感觉自己几乎能听懂她。

hangonreddit
Oh I love the sound of German. As a native Chinese speaker who grew up in the US, I never understood that stereotype.

哦，我喜欢德语的声音。作为在美国长大的中文母语者，我从来不理解那种刻板印象。

eikoebi
All I associate German with is my mom yelling and calling us dumb cows and other really mean things in German. I hate it and she wants us to learn it before she passes. No thanks, I'm sticking to learning Chinese from my Taiwanese husband.

我对德语的所有联想就是我妈妈用德语大喊大叫，叫我们笨牛和其他很刻薄的话。我讨厌它，她想让我们在她去世前学会它。不，谢谢，我坚持跟我的台湾（地区）丈夫学中文。

Bebebaubles
Damn that’s too bad. Me and my husband joked that we should have our kid learn German so he can attend German universities for cheap if he/she ever needed to. Learning any other language is a plus though.

该死，这太糟糕了。我和我丈夫开玩笑说我们应该让孩子学德语，这样如果他/她需要，就可以便宜地去德国大学上学。不过学任何其他语言都是加分项。

courtadvice1
Likewise people think German is an ugly language
Now that's just crazy.

同样，人们认为德语是丑陋的语言。
现在这简直疯了。

Somewanwan
Bruh. Why do you need this stupid association to justify it. The same cute girl speaking the same phrase in German, Italian, English or French I would easily tell you German sounds most grating to hear by far. It's the common phonemes, same as with Chinese, not anything else.

兄弟。你为什么需要这种愚蠢的联想来证明它。让同一个可爱的女孩说同一句话，用德语、意大利语、英语或法语，我会很容易地告诉你，德语听起来最刺耳，是常见的音素的问题，和中文一样，不是其他任何东西。

DragoFlame
Wrong. French is one of the worst languages I have ever heard. I don't care for the Latin languages in general but French is by far the worst sounding. Portuguese right after.

错了，法语是我听过的最糟糕的语言之一，我一般不喜欢拉丁语系，但法语绝对是最难听的，葡萄牙语紧随其后。

thissexypoptart
Pleasant and unpleasant are subjective.
You can’t say any language can sound pleasant when it’s a subjective assessment.
It’s just reality that, to a lot of non speakers, languages like German, Russian, Arabic, and Chinese tend to sound “unpleasant” subjectively. While other languages, e.g. French or Japanese, tend to sound “pleasant”
Again. Completely subjective. But the stats bare this out, when you look at general global surveys.

悦耳和难听是主观的。
你不能说任何语言都能听起来悦耳，因为这是主观评估。

现实就是，对很多非母语者来说，像德语、俄语、阿拉伯语和中文这样的语言主观上往往听起来“不悦耳”。而其他语言，例如法语或日语，往往听起来“悦耳”。
再说一次，完全是主观的，当你看普遍性的全球调查时，统计数据证实了这一点。

Sentryion
It's incredible how one Austrian painter changes how the German language will forever be perceived
Meanwhile, Italian doesnt get as much of a rep despite of Mussolini

一个奥地利画家就这样永远改变了人们对德语的认知，这太不可思议了。
与此同时，尽管有墨索里尼，意大利语却没有得到那么多负面评价。

mongooseisapex
As a speaker of all the languages mentioned in the post, it REALLY depends on the regional dialect, speaker, and situation. If it's comparing listening to the languages in the most mundane, normal conversation, there isn't really a language that sounds better or worse. Now SE Asian languages on the other hand... ooof... I'm kidding!

作为帖子里提到的所有语言的使用者，这真的取决于区域方言、说话者和情境。如果是比较在最平凡、正常的对话中听这些语言，其实没有哪种语言听起来更好或更差。另一方面，东南亚语言……哎呀……我开玩笑的！

Left_Hegelian
It is mostly mere exposure effect. But a lot of people find it hard that their aesthetic preferences, however authentic it seems, are often a result of psychological conditioning, and it tells more about their upbringing than the obxt of judgment itself.

这主要是单纯的曝光效应。但很多人很难接受，他们的美学偏好无论看起来多么真实，往往是心理条件反射的结果，它更多地反映了他们的成长环境，而不是评判对象本身。

lattestim
yes!!! i started watching the netflix show “dark” (which i recommend!) with english subs and original german dialogues to see if it was too distracting and was surprised by how pleasant it sounded and finished the show like that :)

是的！！！我开始看Netflix剧《暗黑》（强烈推荐！），用英语字幕和原版德语对话，看看是否太分散注意力，结果惊讶地发现它听起来多么悦耳，然后就这样看完了整部剧 :)

alleluiarion
Tbh I’ve heard many people describe tonal languages as ugly, maybe dissonant sounding or lacking a certain melodic quality. My longtime white American roommate has always said that I sound like I’m yelling whenever I speak to my (Northern Chinese) parents lol, no matter what is actually being said.

说实话，我听过很多人把声调语言描述为丑陋的，可能听起来不和谐或缺乏某种旋律感。我长期的白人美国室友总是说，无论实际上在说什么，每次我和我（北方中国人）父母说话时，我听起来都像在大喊大叫，哈哈。

bigdatabro
I think languages with more contour tones like Cantonese and Vietnamese can sound jarring to people unfamiliar with tonal languages. In non-tonal languages, tone usually conveys emotion or attitude, so if you spoke English with those same inflections, it would sound really angry or sarcastic.

我觉得像粤语和越南语这样有更多曲折声调的语言，对不熟悉声调语言的人来说可能听起来刺耳。在非声调语言中，声调通常传达情感或态度，所以如果你用英语用同样的语调说话，听起来会非常像生气或讽刺。

arbiter12
so if you spoke English with those same inflections, it would sound really angry or sarcastic

I think you just helped me make sense of something that always annoyed me in my Mandarin tutor. She kept saying "Yeh....Right...." with what I would define as down-tone on both word, making her sound really sarcastic at worst and really bored at best.

Now I think she probably was just thinking in tonal, while speaking in non-tonal (she was not a sarcastic person, it was just the way she talked. Really serious woman.)

所以如果你用英语用同样的语调说话，听起来会非常生气或讽刺。

我觉得你刚刚帮我弄明白了为什么我普通话老师总让我恼火的一件事。她总是说“Yeh....Right....”，用我定义为两个词都降调的方式，让她听起来最坏的情况是非常讽刺，最好的情况是非常无聊。

现在我觉得她可能只是在用声调思考，同时用非声调说话（她不是一个讽刺的人，这只是她说话的方式。一个非常严肃的女人。）

ChromeGames923
Chinese itself is also very broad as a family of languages. I find northern Chinese (eg Mandarin) languages much more unpleasant, as compared to southern Chinese languages

中文本身作为一个语系也非常广泛。比起南方中文语言，我觉得北方中文（例如普通话）听起来更不悦耳。

perishableintransit
HMM never thought of grouping it like that. I’m HK canto and reflexively find putonghua very ugly sounding but I figured that was just the localist bias that I inherited that I tried to resist reproducing even though I always felt it in my head when I heard people speaking it. But maybe it is a north south thing!

嗯，从来没想过这样分组。我是香港（特区）粤语使用者，本能地觉得普通话听起来很丑，但我以为那只是我继承的地方主义偏见，我试图抵抗这种感觉再次产生，不过每次听到人们说普通话时我脑子里总有这种感觉。但也许这就是南北差异！

ChromeGames923
Well I myself was also making a bit of a generalization, in that most northern Chinese speak some dialect of Mandarin, while in the south there's many more different languages, many of which are pleasing to my ears (Wu, Min, Cantonese...)

嗯，我自己也做了点泛化，大多数北方中国人说某种普通话方言，而南方有更多不同的语言，其中很多听起来让我很舒服（吴语、闽语、粤语……）

elviscostume
> I sound like I’m yelling whenever I speak to my parents
Well for me that's because I am lolol. Chinese people from some regions have an aggressive way of talking, like how Americans from New York talk more aggressively and louder. Meanwhile Taiwanese and Southern Chinese people talk much more slowly and softly.

>我每次跟我父母说话听起来都像在大喊大叫

对我来说那是因为我确实在喊，哈哈。某些地区的中国人说话方式比较咄咄逼人，就像纽约美国人说话更咄咄逼人和更大声一样。同时台湾（地区）人和南方中国人说话要慢得多、柔和得多。

Indicosa91
I would argue this is also about the ways of the language in a cultural context. Arabic, Italian, Spanish, Greek are famously reported by English speakers as 'they sound angry", specially in close contexts (the moments with the parents haha or with friends) because in cultures where those languages have been rooted for centuries is pretty common to speak louder, or seem more emotional than...well, English traditional speech, which is pretty "germanic" style of correctedness. This is to say, clichés are everywhere, some part is real and some part is exaggerated in other cultures, and if you happen to be exposed to those other cultures, well ...be aware of that.

我想说这也跟语言在文化语境中的使用方式有关。说英语的人说阿拉伯语、意大利语、西班牙语和希腊语“听起来很生气”，尤其在亲密语境中（跟父母或朋友的时候哈哈），因为在这些语言扎根几个世纪的文化中，大声说话或显得更情绪化是很常见的，而英语传统的说话方式是相当“日耳曼式”的克制。

这就是说，陈词滥调到处都是，有些部分是真实的，有些部分在其他文化中被夸大了，如果你有机会接触那些其他文化，那就……要注意这一点。

bebilov
Angry and loud are two different things. Especially Italian and Spanish have always had the reputation of being "love languages", sweet and smooth. I do agree with Arabic though cause it has a lot of gluttoral sounds that sound very harsh so it gives you the idea that the speaker is angry.

生气和大声是两回事。尤其是意大利语和西班牙语一直有“爱情语言”的美誉，甜美而流畅。不过关于阿拉伯语我同意，因为它有很多喉音，听起来很刺耳，所以给人说话者很生气的印象。

Capable_Studio_6631
If an Arab, Greek or Italian sounds angry its 100% because they are yelling and being loud.
Greek/Bulgarian here. The languages can sound pleasing if the things said are pleasing with affectionate tone.
It's not the language, its the culture.

如果一个阿拉伯人、希腊人或意大利人听起来很生气，那100%是因为他们在喊叫和大声说话。
我是希腊/保加利亚人。如果说的内容是令人愉快的，并且带着亲切的语气，这些语言可以听起来很悦耳。
不是语言的问题，是文化的问题。

Yugan-Dali
Yelling is volume. I bet if your roommate listened to your northern Mandarin and my Taiwanese Mandarin, he would think they are different languages, but we could have a conversation without really paying much attention to our different accents.

喊叫是音量问题。我敢打赌，如果你室友听你的北方普通话和我的台湾（地区）普通话，他会以为是不同的语言，但我们其实可以不用太注意不同口音就能对话。

elsif1
I could see fourth tone in particular sounding a bit aggressive depending on how much you lean into it

我能理解第四声特别听起来有点强烈，这取决于你有多强调它。

mr_swedishfish
yeah I'm vietnamese (six tones) and many people say it sounds harsh and not pleasant to listen to. I grew up speaking southern dialect at that, which sounds "worse" and even more harsh. I only ever see people complimenting the northern dialect.

是的，我是越南人（六声调），很多人说它听起来刺耳不悦耳。我从小说南方方言，那听起来“更糟”，而且更刺耳。我只见过人们夸北方方言。

SirMiba
Depends. I think Chinese can sound beautiful, but it's like listening to Random German Dude speaking German vs listening to Ave Maria (Schubert); it can sound kind of harsh but also beautiful. Right now I'm watching Frieren in Mandarin Chinese, and it's honestly very good and sounds nice.
So from my perspective, it's not always the most beautiful sounding language, but it can sound elegant, very refined, and full of intent when the delivery is right.

这取决于。我觉得中文可以听起来很美，但就像听随便一个德国人说德语 vs 听《圣母颂》（舒伯特）；它可能听起来有点刺耳，但也可以很美。现在我正在看普通话配音的《葬送的芙莉莲》，老实说非常好听。

所以从我的角度看，它并不总是最优美的语言，但当表达方式正确时，它可以听起来优雅、非常精炼，并且充满意图。

Anru_Kitakaze
I'm from Russia and I had this feeling before. But then I actually give it a try: some songs, games and shows (background under dub) and then I figured out Chinese is actually really beautiful
Now I choose Chinese over Japanese any day because I can't hear overreacting and super high pitch anymore
On top of that, about 4 months ago I even started to learn Chinese (mostly Anki + 50 minutes of speech with Chinese native twice a week) and now it's 100x more pleasant since I can understand some simple dialogues. Feels absolutely amazing and I don't want to stop at all

我来自俄罗斯，以前也有这种感觉。但后来我真的试了试：一些歌曲、游戏和节目（带配音的背景），然后我发现中文其实真的很美。
现在我每天都选择中文而不是日语，因为我再也听不到过度反应和超级高的音调了。

除此之外，大约4个月前我甚至开始学中文（主要是Anki + 每周两次每次50分钟和中文母语者对话），现在因为我能听懂一些简单对话，它听起来比以前好100倍。感觉太棒了，我完全不想停下来。

【译注，Anki是一个辅助记忆的字卡软件】

Kellogg-
+1 The Japanese fit in well with today's audience, because of their over-acting.

+1 日本人很适合如今的观众，因为他们表演过度。

Linus_Naumann
I'm a Westerner living in China for 2 years now and learning Chinese (~B1/2 level). Originally I also didn't like the sound of Chinese and that's not because I was sinophobic or anything like that. It was just because the phonetics, tones, word structure and speaking rhythm were just very far away from what I was used to growing up.
For example, Chinese has many words that the untrained ear literally interprets as "noises", like 支持 (Zhi Chi) or 紫色 (Zi Se), etc., because they don't follow typical consonant-vocal patterns. Japanese on the other hand follows those 100%, making it sound familiar.
Second, Chinese sentence melody is massively different to Western languages because of the tones. You have what the Western ear interprets as a question (second tone) or the end of a sentence (4th tone) at random places in every sentence. Multiple first-tones back-to-back sound like an 80s impression of a robot talking (for example 星期一).
None of these things are obxtively more or less aesthetic than any other language, they are just far away from what Westerners are used to hear. In the same way English people might find German or Slavic consonant clusters "ugly" at first, simply because they are different. Japanese however, despite being a completely unrelated language, somehow uses similar phonemes, multi-syllable word structures and sentence rhythms like Western languages. So, as long as you ignore grammar etc, it superficially just sounds more familiar and thereby more "beautiful".

我是一个西方人，现在在中国生活2年，正在学中文（大约B1/2水平）。最初我也不喜欢中文的声音，这并不是因为我恐华或类似原因。只是因为它的语音、声调、词结构和说话节奏跟我从小习惯的非常不同。

例如，中文有很多词对未经训练的耳朵来说听起来简直像“噪音”，比如 支持 (Zhi Chi) 或 紫色 (Zi Se) 等，因为它们不遵循典型的辅音-元音模式。而日语则100%遵循这些模式，听起来很熟悉。

其次，由于声调，中文的句子旋律与西方语言有巨大差异。你会在每句话的随机位置听到以西方耳朵解读的疑问句（第二声）或句子结束（第四声），连续多个第一声听起来像80年代机器人说话的印象（例如 星期一）。

这些东西没有哪种语言客观上更美或更丑，它们只是远离西方人习惯听到的东西。就像英国人一开始可能会觉得德语或斯拉夫语的辅音集群“丑陋”，仅仅因为它们不同。然而日语尽管是完全无关的语言，却不知怎地在音素、多音节词结构和句子节奏上与西方语言相似。所以，只要忽略语法等，它表面上听起来就更熟悉，从而更“美丽”。

daniel21020
Couldn't say it better myself. Thanks for pointing this out; it really does seem like a subjective thing.

我自己也说不出更好的了。谢谢你指出这一点；这确实似乎是一件主观的事情。

Ill_conceived_idea
I love how you describe the tones, as someone who is trying to learn the hardest part for me is how do I make those tones? I've been watching Cdramas long enough where I believe I can hear those tones...an improvement...but now it's pronouncement. How you said those tones are supposed to show up really help me visualize how to say them.

我喜欢你对声调的描述，作为一个正在尝试学习的人，对我来说最难的部分是如何发出那些声调？我看中文剧已经够久了，我相信我能听到那些声调……这是一种进步……但现在是发音问题。你说的那些声调应该出现的位置真的帮助我形象化如何说出它们。

Remni11
100% this. We're simply not used to the way Chinese sounds, and most of us have been exposed to Japanese via anime and videogames since a young age, so it's just natural we feel more inclined to the flow of that language. Also as I native Spanish speaker, Japanese just shares too many sounds with my mother tongue, so it's a lot easier to if not understand at least make out distinct words.

100%同意。我们只是不习惯中文的声音，而且我们大多数人从小就通过动漫和电子游戏接触日语，所以我们自然更倾向于那种语言的流动感。另外作为母语西班牙语的人，日语与我的母语共享太多声音，所以即使不能理解，至少更容易分辨出不同的词。

milkmocha
:(( Chinese is really beautiful to listen to!! i personally really like a lot of Chinese voice actors

:(( 中文听起来真的很美！！我个人非常喜欢很多中文配音演员。

Meiyouxiangjiao
The voice actors and singers are fantastic

配音演员和歌手都很棒。

Vengeful111
Agreed, I could never play Where winds meet with a different VO!

同意，我玩《燕云十六声》时绝对不能用其他配音！

Infinite-Chocolate46
Japanese used to be a language that was considered "cold" or "business-like" until the bubble burst and the anime boom happened. Perspectives change.
It's possible that Chinese will be viewed differently in the West in the next few generations as China develops its pop culture. But right now it doesn't have that cutesy association like Japanese does.

日语曾经被认为是“冷酷的”或“商务式的”语言，直到经济泡沫破裂和动漫热潮兴起，对日语的观点改变了。

随着中国发展自己的流行文化，在未来几代人中，中文在西方的看法可能会不同。但现在它没有像日语那样的做作而可爱的联想。

jajangmien
I think a majority in this situation grew up watching anime so it's just what they are more used to. Hell I'm half Chinese and speak the language myself but prefer JP voice acting as well.
Personally I really dislike the types of voices they use for women in Chinese VOs. They always pick someone that sounds like they are trying real hard to do a fake young cutest girl voice and it is super annoying.

我觉得在这种看法下的大多数人都是看着动漫长大的，所以他们只是更习惯那个。该死，我自己是半中国人，也会说这门语言，但我还是更喜欢日语配音。

就我个人而言，我真的不喜欢他们在中国视频中对女性使用的声音类型。他们总是选择那些听起来很努力地模仿年轻可爱女孩声音的人，这令人很烦。

SpookyBao
Your issue with Chinese voice acting is super prent in Japanese voice acting. All the female characters sound the same and try too hard to be cute or overly sexualized.

你对中国配音的意见在日本配音中也非常普遍，所有女性角色听起来都一样，而且太努力想表现得可爱或过度性感化。

jajangmien
I'm not going to debate you on voice acting, but I grew up (as many other have) with those voices so I'm use to it.

我不打算和你辩论配音，但我（和其他很多人一样）是听着那些声音长大的，所以我习惯了。

btherl
I think you've got it here, at least for me. It's not racism or fetishization, as others have suggested, instead it's just familiarity. Japanese voice acting is what we associate with anime.

That said, Mandarin Chinese did sound rough to me, until I learnt it. The tones sounded like random emphasis, and it sounded "angry". Japanese allows for a more English style melody, which is also more familiar. If there is tone, it's part of the emotional message only.

我觉得你说到点子上了，至少对我来说是。它不是别人说的种族主义或迷恋，而是熟悉感，日本配音是我们与动漫关联的东西。

话虽如此，在我学会之前，普通话听起来确实很粗糙。声调听起来像随机的强调，而且听起来像“生气了”。日语允许更像英语风格的旋律，这也更让人熟悉。如果有声调，它也只是情感信息的一部分。

East_Push8613
The Chinesw need to stop using the high-pitch gurly cute helpless lady. I know women who wont watch shows after thry bring in the squeaky little girl-voice actress. Do men really want that in China? No way. I don't believe it.

中国人需要停止使用那种高音调、娇滴滴、可爱无助的女士声音。我认识有些女性在剧里出现那种吱吱作响的小女孩声音的女演员后就不看了。中国男人真的想要那个吗？不可能。我不相信。

jajangmien
Everyone likes what they like. I have been trying to listen to Chinese VOs lately just to keep my Chinese up to snuff. Maybe it'll start growing on me. I have been enjoying the Where Winds Meet voice overs in Chinese way more than any other language.

每个人喜欢什么就是什么，我最近一直在试着听中文配音，只是为了保持我的中文水平。也许它会慢慢让我喜欢上。比起其它语言，我越来越喜欢《燕云十六声》的中文配音。

SpookyBao
Okay? I’m not saying people need to like the cutesy voices, I’m just pointing out that Japanese VAs have the same problem.

好吧？我不是说人们必须喜欢可爱的声音，我只是指出日本配音演员也有同样的问题。

Insopitus1227
I, on the contarary, hate Japanese voice acting in anime. Everyone sounds overly emotional, like, dude, do Japanese people really talk like this in real life?

相反，我讨厌动漫里的日本配音。大家听起来都像过度情绪化，哥们，日本人在现实生活中真的这样说话吗？

PCael2301
They typically don't. Think of how characters often talk in some American cartoons, or Mexican telenovelas. The emotional affect is toned up for the medium and the story. I've even heard some Japanese speakers complain about it, saying it's cringe, essentially, and saying it's one reason they might feel embarrassed to watch anime.

他们通常不会，想想美国卡通或墨西哥电视剧里角色经常怎么说话，那些情感效果是为媒体和故事而加强了的。我甚至听过一些日本人抱怨，说这本质上是畏缩，这也是他们可能觉得看动漫尴尬的原因之一。

jhanschoo
It's just one person stating their opinion carelessly as universal truth, which is something a lot of people tend to do. Don't pay it any heed. Most people in the US for instance haven't heard anywhere near enough Mandarin and Japanese to form an opinion how it sounds, in a society that speaks it everyday.

这只是一个人不小心把自己的意见当作普遍真理说出来，很多人都倾向于这么做。别在意。例如，美国大多数人根本没有听过足够多的普通话和日语，来形成在日常使用这些语言的社会中对它们的声音的看法。

TheWorldInMotion
A random person on Twitter does not represent all Western people.

推特上的一个随机人并不能代表所有西方人。

kotassium2
One tweet from a racist and you are forming your opinion on hundreds of millions of people about it? 

一条来自种族主义者的推文，你们就据此对数亿人形成了自己的看法？

TheTalkativeDoll
I don't agree with how that tweet was worded, but personally, and even as an overseas Chinese, I prefer Japanese audio for games I play (like Genshin Impact) because I grew up listening to Japanese anime and playing jRPGs. I just feel that Japanese audio/dubs express and emote dialogue better than Mandarin when it comes to video games and sometimes with series too, which of course is just my own opinion. I probably understand like 5-8% of what is being said in Japanese without the help of subtitles versus if I were to listen to it in Mandarin, but somehow I still lean towards Japanese audio and generally choose this as the audio (with English subtitles) for video games.

我不认同那条推文的措辞，但就我个人而言，即使作为海外华人，我玩游戏时（比如原神）还是更喜欢日语音频，因为我是听着日本动漫和玩日式RPG长大的。我只是觉得在电子游戏中，有时在剧集中，日语音频/配音比普通话更好地表现和传达了对话，这当然只是我个人的意见。我在没有字幕帮助的情况下大概只懂日语说的5-8%，而如果是普通话我能懂更多，但不知为什么我还是倾向于日语音频，并且一般选择这个作为游戏的音频（带英文字幕）。

SpookyBao
I don’t know, I feel the Chinese voice acting is better than the JP one. Personally the JP sounds stale and generic and the emotions are harder for me to discern but of course it’s super subjective. Additionally the JP voices are often miscast like Ganyu, Robin, and Evernight sounds incredibly off in JP. The CN voices are a lot better imo for those three.

我不知道，我觉得中文配音比日语的好。就我个人而言，日语听起来陈旧且普通，很难辨别其中的情绪，但这当然是非常主观的。另外日语配音经常选角不当，比如甘雨、知更鸟和永夜在日语中听起来非常不对劲。在我看来，这三个角色的中文配音好多了。

Less-Banana4938
I agree, I play hsr and some characters in Japanese don't sound that good for me compared to the Chinese or English dub (e.g. The Herta, her voice in jp sounds off for me)

我同意，我玩《崩铁》，比起中文或英语配音，有些角色在日语中对我来说听起来没那么好，（例如黑塔，她用日语说话的声音听起来很刺耳）

Kimorin
i'm Chinese and i think japanese sounds better than Chinese
because Chinese doesn't flow as well, its individual sounds can sound harsh, also for most ppl it's probably the tones that can sound weird too

我是华人，我觉得日语比中文好听.
因为中文流动感没那么好，它的单个音可以听起来刺耳，而且对大多数人来说它的声调可能听起来也很奇怪.

No_One_Specific
This is really interesting to hear! Do you know other Chinese people who feel similarly?
Personally, I prefer the sound of Mandarin over Japanese... but I like harsh, rhythmic sounds. I listen to a lot of Jungle and Drum & Bass, and those can be an incredibly harsh, syncopated style of music. I also took a year of Mandarin in college, so I learned to appreciate it through practice.

这真的很有趣！ 你认识其他有类似感觉的中国人吗？
就我个人而言，我更喜欢普通话的声音而不是日语……但我喜欢刺耳、有节奏的声音。我听了很多Jungle乐队和Drum & Bass乐队的歌，那里面有些非常刺耳、切分音风格的音乐。我大学也学了一年普通话，所以通过练习学会了欣赏它。

Lucid_Flame
I personally think Chinese and Korean sound quite nice, I actually think Japanese doesn't sound very pleasant at all. This is all purely based on personal opinions tho, not every western person will think the same way lol

我个人觉得中文和韩文听起来挺好听的，我其实觉得日语一点都不悦耳。不过这完全基于个人意见，不是每个西方人都会这么想，哈哈。

megumishoe
We're all so different, I love Chinese and Japanese, but I dislike how Korean sounds and despite learning Korean, something about the language sounds jarring to my ears.

我们都各不相同，我喜欢中文和日语，但我讨厌韩语听起来怎么样，尽管我在学韩语，但这种语言有些地方听起来还是很刺耳。

Last_Swordfish9135
It's half sinophobia and half fetishization of Japan. The people who do stuff like this are mostly American losers who base their whole personality on obsessing over Japan and Japanese media.

这是一半恐华和一半对日本的迷恋，做这种事的人大多是美国的失败者，他们把整个人格建立在对日本和日本媒体的痴迷上。

Equivalent-Dingo8309
Lol the tweet is very generalizing and quite narrow-minded.
There are multiple layers to each language mentioned.
-As a gamer, I understand that people tend to romanticize "Japan", but for good reason. They have longer history in gaming, and world-class voice actors/actresses. Of course their dub is going to be better in general.
-When people say Chinese, the first image that pops up may be Chinese tourists yelling because this is the stereotype. Yes, Chinese people are known to be loud, but not necessarily hostile.
-Also, Chinese VA in games are usually more "cutesy" than cool, so this may feel weird for western gamers.
-Chinese also have a lot of different accents, I personally enjoy hearing female VA in Chinese, it just sounds soothing.

哈哈那条推文非常泛化而且相当狭隘。
提到的每种语言都有多个层次。

-作为一个游戏玩家，我理解人们倾向于浪漫化“日本”，这有充分理由，他们在游戏上有更长的历史，而且有世界级的配音演员，他们的配音总体上当然会更好。

-当人们说起中文时，第一个跳出来的形象可能是中国游客在大喊大叫，因为这是刻板印象。是的，中国人以大声闻名，但不一定是敌对的。

-另外，游戏里的中文配音通常比酷更“可爱”，所以这对西方游戏玩家来说可能感觉奇怪。
-中文也有很多不同的口音，我个人喜欢听中文里的女性配音，它听起来很舒缓。

redditorialy_retard
Some languages have generally audible traits. For example
German often sounds harsher due to features like glottal stops and guttural sounds. 
French sounds significantly smoother and more melodic because of liaison and its even syllable-timed rhythm.
Spanish sounds rapid and "staccato" because of its short, consistent vowel lengths and lack of word-final stress.
Arabic sounds rich and textural due to its unique "pharyngeal" sounds produced deep in the throat.
Mandarin can sound harsh or "argumentative" in speech because of its sharp tonal shifts and aspirated "ch" and "sh" sounds, but it becomes incredibly soft and fluid in song as the musical melody smooths out those linguistic tones. (that's why subtitles are everywhere in music videos)
Vietnamese is often perceived as jarring or "choppy" because of its six-tone system and glottalized endings, but it sounds absolutely beautiful in singing where the harsh tonal inflections are omitted to follow the music.

有些语言通常具有可听得出来的特征，例如

德语经常因为喉塞音和喉音等特征听起来更刺耳。
法语因为连音和均匀的音节定时节奏听起来明显更流畅和更有旋律。

西班牙语因为短而一致的元音长度和缺少词尾重音听起来快速而“断断续续”。
阿拉伯语因为它独特的在喉咙深处产生的“咽音”听起来丰富而有质感。

普通话在说话中因为尖锐的声调转变和“ch”和“sh”送气音可能听起来刺耳或有“争议性”，但在歌曲中随着音乐旋律抚平那些语言声调，它变得难以置信地柔和和流畅。（这就是音乐视频里到处是字幕有原因）

越南语因为它的六声调系统和喉塞音结尾经常被感知为刺耳或“断续”，但在唱歌中当刺耳的声调变化被省略以跟随音乐时，它听起来绝对美丽。

Ray3335
I think both sound great if the voice acting has good quality! Personally I prefer Chinese, I'm learning mandarin :D

我觉得如果配音质量好，两者听起来都很棒！就我个人而言我更喜欢中文，我在学普通话 :D

barryhakker
As a Dutch native I like Chinese but yes, I think Japanese and e.g. Korean sound better. I also think all three of those sound better than Dutch lol.

作为荷兰母语者，我喜欢中文，但是，我觉得日语和韩语听起来更好，我也觉得这三种都比荷兰语好听，哈哈。

kaatuwu
as a spanish speaker i find Chinese one of the most beautiful languages I've ever heard and japanese the middest sounding thing

作为一个西班牙语使用者，我觉得中文是我听过的最美丽的语言之一，而日语是最平庸的语言。

jjnanajj
As a portuguese speaker, this is exactly how i feel, too. The more i consume Chinese media, the more i fall in love with the language and its nuances.

作为一个葡萄牙语使用者，我的感觉也完全一样。我越看中文媒体，我就越爱上这门语言和它的细微差别。

Felix_Felicis__
Absolutely not. For me,Chinese is like tiny poems in every word, and each character actually contains a story, it's beautiful, looks beautiful, sounds beautiful.

绝对不是。对我来说，中文似乎每个词里都是小诗，每个字其实都包含一个故事，它很美，看起来美，听起来也美。

Slightlycritical1
Chinese sounds rough, but nowhere nearly as bad as Vietnamese. Korean and Japanese sound better to the west because they don’t have tones in the same way.

中文听起来粗糙，但远没有越南语那么糟糕。韩语和日语对西方来说听起来更好，因为它们没有同样的声调。

redditorialy_retard
For real hahaha, I like to listen to some viet music but hearing normal Vietnamese for the first time immediately hurts my ears.

真的哈哈哈，我喜欢听一些越南音乐，但第一次听到正常的越南语立刻就伤到了我的耳朵。

Sensitive-Bison-8192
Because the Vietnamese language is incredibly rich in diphthongs.

因为越南语在双元音上极其丰富。

redditorialy_retard
is that the one that kinda sounds like you're gagging or about to vomit? I think it's the Ư and Ơ or smth I don't remember

是那种听起来有点像你在干呕或要吐的那种吗？我想是Ư和Ơ什么的，我不记得了.

Sensitive-Bison-8192
Yes, languages ​​with complex vowels don't sound good.

是的，有复杂元音的语言听起来不好。

redditorialy_retard
I wonder why tho, and we can really see when we remove the vowel rules E in singing that it immediately sounds nicer

我想知道为什么，而且我们真的可以看到当我们移除元音规则，比如在唱歌时，它立刻听起来更好了.

Honmer
i think it’s more that westerners fetishise japan

我觉得更多是西方人迷恋日本.

Guilty_Fishing8229
There’s a lot of degenerate western weebs who are Japanese chauvinists on top of that.
But they are nowhere near the status of speaking for “western people” as a whole.
X is a site owned by a white nationalist, who pumps the algorithm to show divisive, racist content.
X itself is a letter that is represented in ASCII as 88 which is a neo-Nazi dogwhistle (8th letter of the alphabet is H)
You’re better off using threads or Bluesky than that racist hellsite

除此之外有很多堕落的西方weeb是日本沙文主义者。
但他们远没有达到代表“西方人”整体的地位。

X是一个由白人民族主义者拥有的网站，他推动算法显示分裂的、种族主义的内容。
X本身是一个在ASCII中表示88的字母，这是新纳粹的狗哨（字母表的第8个字母是H）
你最好用threads或Bluesky，而不是这种种族主义的地狱网站.

【Weeb 是 Weeaboo的缩写，通常指那些对日本流行文化（特别是动漫、漫画、游戏）极度痴迷的非日本人士，带有贬义，译注】

TheBigCore
A female comedian said this in a podcast but in general Americans’ understanding of east Asia is all based on their perception of Japanese culture.
Japan is the USA's vassal, so it has easy access to American culture as the safe "little East-Asian brother." Japanese pop culture is also very strong, especially manga, anime, and video games. China doesn't really have strong equivalents that have reached American shores.
Also in contrast, China is "hostile" to the US with its "communist" government and competing global economy. China is not subservient to American economic and cultural hegemony the way Japan currently is.
When the average American sees China, they only see Communism and nothing else.
As a country, Americans are not the sharpest tools in the shed and they lack intellectual curiosity.

一个女喜剧演员在播客里说过，总体上美国人对东亚的理解都基于他们对日本文化的认知。

日本是美国的附庸，所以它能轻松接触美国文化，作为安全的“东亚小弟”。日本流行文化也很强大，尤其是漫画、动漫和电子游戏。中国并没有真正强大的同类产品登陆美国。
另外相比之下，中国因为“共产主义”政府和竞争激烈的全球经济而与美国“敌对”，中国不像日本目前那样屈从于美国的经济和文化霸权。

当普通美国人看到中国时，他们只看到共产主义，其他什么都没有。
作为一个国家，美国人都有点笨拙，他们缺乏求知欲。