为什么越南不修建高速铁路？

Ralph Nhatrang
Mostly it was a matter of finance. When the Party proposed a Bill to the National Assembly some years ago to build a $100 billion high speed train service between Hanoi and Saigon:
No internal finance was available;
No foreign finance was available, including from the World Bank and Asian Development Bank;
The director of Vietnam Railways pointed out in a published letter that, were the line be built, it would still be cheaper and quicker to fly.
The National Assembly, in a rare display of independence, voted down the Party’s proposal. But the Party continues to think it’s a good idea.
A high speed railway is now being built between Saigon and Can Tho and other proposals are for Hanoi-Haiphong, Hanoi-Sapa and Saigon-Nha Trang lixs. What is also badly needed is a fast (not high speed) goods transport train service between the major cities of Vietnam.
 
主要是资金问题。几年前，党向国会提交了一项议案，计划投资1000亿美元在河内和西贡之间建设一条高速铁路：
国内没有可用资金；
国外也没有资金，包括世界银行和亚洲开发银行的资助；
越南铁路公司的负责人在一封公开信中指出，即使铁路建成，乘飞机旅行仍然会更经济、更快捷。
国会罕见地独立行使权力，否决了党的提案。但党仍然认为这是一个好主意。
目前正在建设西贡至芹苴的高速铁路，同时还有计划修建连接河内至海防、河内至沙巴、西贡至芽庄的铁路线路。此外，越南各主要城市之间也迫切需要一条快速货运铁路服务。
 
Lucia Millar
Dear Ralph Nhatrang
The Party did not propose but the government did propose this project. Of course, you could say the party members from the government proposed it.
 
亲爱的Ralph Nhatrang，
提出这个项目的实际上是政府，而不是党。当然，你也可以说，是政府中的党员提出了这个项目。
 
In the political structure of Vietnam, the party often does not intervene directly in the administrative activities of the government, as well as the making laws activities of the Vietnamese assembly. All projects and other economic activities have been administrated by the Vietnamese government and also proposed by the Vietnamese governments, not from the Party. The assembly will make laws that the government must follow as well as re-check the government activities. The party seems to be advisors behind both the Vietnamese state bodies including government and assembly. If the party really wishes to do any project, I doubt the assembly could prevent it because most of the members of the Vietnamese assembly are Party members.
 
在越南的政治体系中，党通常不会直接介入政府的行政管理活动，也不会干预国会的立法活动。所有项目和其他经济活动都是由越南政府管理和提出的，而不是由党提出的。国会负责制定政府必须遵守的法律，并重新审查政府的活动。该党似乎是越南政府和议会等国家机关的幕后顾问。如果党真的想做任何项目，我怀疑大会能否阻止它，因为越南议会的大多数成员都是党员。
 
Quôc Trân Pham
It is above all a matter of money: Consider the urban railroad line under construction now in Saigon has reached an astronomical cost per km (and is now put on standby). A Quoran has posted an answer detailing the high flying costs of that very first railway. Now transpose the costs to a long distance high speed railway which would require even more robust and safe infrastructures.
 
归根结底，这是一个资金问题：想想目前在西贡建设中的地铁线路，每公里的成本高得惊人（目前已暂停建设）。有位Quora用户已经详细说明了那条首条铁路的高昂费用。现在把成本转移到长途高速铁路上，这将需要更坚固和安全的基础设施。
 
Anyway, it is a sound decision because operating high speed trains requires another level of risk management that Vietnamese people are not prepared to: Do you know that on currently, despite the snail pace of Vietnamese trains (under 60km/h) on average, there is one accident a week involving a train and another transportation mean.
 
无论如何，这是一个明智的决策，因为运营高速列车需要更高级别的风险管理，而越南人民对此尚未做好准备：你知道吗，即使目前越南火车的速度慢如蜗牛（平均低于60公里/小时），每周仍有一起涉及火车和其他交通工具的事故发生。
 
Julia Vasileva
What are you talking about XD For many years they can’t even finish building their first metro in Vietnam. Speed railways… (http://railways….no) no comments
 
兄弟，你在说什么? 多年来他们连越南的第一条地铁都建不完。至于高速铁路，不予置评（http://railways….no）。
 
Nugeny
Vietnam right now has the right solution. They are building huge airports. Yes it cheaper and way steadier than any train. I would fly any time.
 
越南目前采取了正确的解决方案，他们正在建设大型机场。是的，这比任何火车都便宜，也更稳定。我任何时候都愿意选择乘坐飞机出行。
 
Dan Le
Why is Vietnam still poor?
It’s a complex issue with no simple answer that captures the multitude of reasons of why Vietnam is ‘poor’. By some international measures of income per capita, as some have stated here, Vietnam has been ‘lifted’ out of poverty and is now enjoying a ‘middle-developed’ status. By other measures, including how the vast majority of Vietnamese live day to day, it still qualifies as ‘poor’.Having lived and worked in Vietnam for many years and still a frequent traveler there, I’ll give my perspective on why I consider Vietnam as ‘too poor’ relative to its resources and abilities. In other words, why Vietnam has not achieved its potential.
 
为什么越南仍然贫穷？
这个问题很复杂，没有简单的答案能够完全解释越南为何被认为“贫穷”。根据一些国际人均收入标准，有人提到，越南已经“摆脱”了贫困，现在正处于“中等发展”国家的行列。然而，根据其他标准，尤其是考虑到大多数越南人的日常生活状况，越南仍然被认为是“贫穷”的。我在越南生活工作过多年，并且现在仍然是那里的常客，我会从我的视角谈谈，相对于越南拥有的资源和能力而言，我认为越南仍然过于贫穷。换句话说，为什么越南还没有达到其应有的发展水平。
 
#1. Corruption, corruption, corruption. It makes you sick to see it and live with it.
 
腐败，腐败，还是腐败。看到它、亲身体验它，让人感到厌恶。
 
It makes you ill to watch hard-working shopkeepers with an entrepreneurial spirit be shaken down by the local police, then the district police, and then the local party head on a regular basis. Even in my capacity as country manager for a large US company, we were visited by representatives from the labour ministry and told we owed $100k to the government because they changed a law last month and made it retroactive for two years. It was just a high-level shakedown. Have a look at the rail system being installed in Ho Chi Minh City, which includes underground and above-ground trains that reach out from District 1 and into District 2 and other areas of greater HCMC.
 
目睹那些辛勤工作的店主们，他们充满创业精神，却经常遭到当地警察、区警察乃至地方党委领导的轮番敲诈，这让人感到厌恶。即便是在我担任一家大型美国公司驻外经理的职位上，我们也曾被劳动部的代表造访，并被告知由于他们上个月修改了一项法律并使其具有追溯效力达两年之久，我们欠政府10万美元。这分明是一场高层的勒索。再看看胡志明市正在建设的铁路系统，它包括从第一区延伸至第二区及其他更大区域的地下和地面列车。
 
On its completion it will be the most expensive rail system ever built IN THE ENTIRE WORLD (it’s still not finished after many years). Is that because the cost of labour is so high in Vietnam or materials are difficult and costly to procure or that the train system is so vast? No. It is because every layer of government official is on the take. Think about that. We are talking tens of millions of dollars that are going into private pockets when it could be used for other public projects to improve the lives of Vietnamese citizens. Corruption is rampant and visible at every level of Vietnamese society and is a cancer that impedes its growth.
 
一旦建成，它将成为全球造价最高的铁路系统（尽管多年过去仍未完工）。这是因为越南的劳动力成本高昂，还是因为材料难以获得且价格昂贵，或者是因为铁路系统规模过于庞大吗？都不是。而是因为各级政府官员都在从中获利。想想这一点，我们谈论的是数千万美金最终落入私人腰包，而这些资金本可以用来改善越南民众生活的其他公共项目。腐败在越南社会的每个层面都普遍存在且显而易见，它像癌症一样阻碍着国家的发展。
 
#2. Poor quality public infrastructure and public goods. I’m not talking about roads - there are many decent roads, particularly in Hanoi (go figure) - or internet, as good wifi is available in even the most remote coffee shops. I’m talking about a) education and b) health care. For all the statistics people touting the ‘great development’ across Vietnam, I invite you to drive one hour outside HCMC or Hanoi or Danang or Nha Trang, and visit a local school or hospital. While some schools are in decent shape, most are in awful condition. It is heartbreaking to see children in small, hot, non-air-conditioned rooms sitting two to a desk and attempting to study. And the toilets - they are usually outside and absolutely filthy beyond descxtion. I know this because I’ve volunteered at a few schools and built playgrounds, etc.
 
越南的公共基础设施和公共服务质量欠佳。我指的不是道路——尤其是在河内，有很多路况不错的道路（这倒是出乎意料）——也不是指互联网，因为在最偏远的咖啡馆里也能享受到优质的无线网络。我指的是教育和医疗保健。对于那些宣称越南“发展迅速”的数据，我建议你驱车离开胡志明市、河内、岘港或芽庄一小时，亲自去当地的学校或医院看看。虽然有些学校条件尚可，但大多数学校的条件非常糟糕。看到孩子们挤在狭小、炎热、没有空调的教室里，两个孩子合用一张课桌，努力地学习，真是令人心痛。至于厕所——它们通常位于室外，脏得难以形容。我之所以了解这些，是因为我曾在几所学校做过志愿者，参与建设操场等项目。
 
 The conditions at many schools are absolutely not conducive to receiving a proper education. Oh and the teachers and staff are all on the take as well, which brings me to one of the biggest shames of Vietnam: the hospitals. I’ve been in them, I’ve visited friends in them, and it is truly shocking. The last time I visited a friend in a hospital was two months ago, and I counted 22 people in a room that was about 16 square meters. People sleeping under beds, patients two to a bed, open windows in this room because there is no air conditioning, letting mosquitos in. Patients sleeping on tiny beds in the hallways. Belligerent ‘doctors’ grumbling everywhere.
 
 许多学校的环境根本不适合学生接受良好的教育。而且，教师和员工也都卷入了贪污，这让我想到了越南最让人羞愧的问题之一：医院。我亲自去过这些医院，也去探望过住院的朋友，那里的情况真的令人震惊。我记得两个月前去探望一位住院的朋友，我数了数，一个大约只有16平方米的房间里竟然挤了22个人。人们睡在床铺下面，病患两人合睡一张床，房间里的窗户敞开着，因为没有空调，这导致蚊子飞进来。病患们甚至睡在走廊的小床上。到处都能听到粗暴的“医生”在发牢骚。
 
 Okay this is bad enough, but what makes it so maddening and heartbreaking is that, like most systems in Vietnam, it is corrupt. I know for a fact that doctors and especially heads of hospitals, as well as local government officials take bribes to give ‘better’ treatment and are paid by pharmaceutical and medical device companies to use their products. They take this money and line their own pockets while their fellow citizens lie in desperate agony in unsanitary hospitals, hoping for a cure from belligerent, semi-qualified ‘doctors’ who are also on the take. It is shocking and depressing to witness.
 
这已经够糟糕了，但更让人愤怒和心碎的是，像越南的许多系统一样，它充满了腐败。我知道，医生，尤其是医院的负责人和地方政府官员，常常收受贿赂，提供所谓的“更好”治疗，还会接受制药公司和医疗器械公司支付的回扣，使用他们的产品。他们拿着这些钱，填满自己的口袋，而普通百姓却在肮脏的医院里痛苦挣扎，绝望地等待着那些也在收受回扣、能力有限的“医生”提供的治疗。亲眼目睹这一切，真是令人震惊和沮丧。
 
#3. Lack of legal infrastructure protecting property rights (there are some even in pseudo-socialist Vietnam) and enforcing contracts. It’s the wild west when it comes to contract enforcement and for the most part, the side that wins a dispute is the one who is ‘better connected’ or who has more ‘power’. And by connections and power I mean the side that ‘knows someone’ in the government, the party, the police, or the army. Especially the army or government; if you have a high-ranking army or government connection you can be assured you will win most of your disputes regardless of merit.
 
在越南，即使这是一个号称社会主义的国家，保护财产权和执行合同的法律体系仍然不完善。合同执行方面几乎是无法无天的西部荒野状态，大多数情况下，赢得争议的一方是那些“关系更硬”或者“权力更大”的人。这里所说的“关系”和“权力”，是指那些在政府、党、警察或军队里（特别是军队或政府内部的高层关系）“有人”的一方。如果您拥有高层军队或政府的关系网，可以肯定的是，您将赢得大多数争议，而无需考虑争议的正当性。
 
So my take is this: Vietnam’s quality of life is not ‘poor’ because its people are unintelligent or lazy or disinterested. Most Vietnamese are very intelligent, aspirational, and willing to work hard for a better life for themselves and for their families. But they unfortunately are swimming upstream against the powerful forces of corruption, poor infrastructure, and lack of property rights and contract enforcement. In the face of such negative forces you would forgive them for thinking, “what’s the point?” and for giving up. If more Vietnamese begin to demand more accountability these negative forces can be reduced and Vietnam can reach its potential as a country much more quickly.
 
我的看法是这样的：越南人民的生活质量不佳，并不是因为越南人民不聪明、懒惰或不思进取。实际上，大多数越南人民都非常聪明、有抱负，并且愿意为了自己和家人的更好生活而辛勤工作。但他们不幸地面临着腐败、基础设施不足以及产权和合同执行不力等强大阻力。面对这些负面力量，人们很容易产生“努力有何意义？”的疑问，甚至选择放弃。如果越来越多的越南人民开始要求更多的问责，这些负面力量就能被削弱，越南作为一个国家就能更快地发挥其潜力。
 
Hoàng Hà Nguyên Vĩnh
Why doesn’t Vietnam have modern ports and airports but is investing on high speed railway?
I assume you dont know because many ports that are being upgraded are military ports or partial military facilities and the government are rather quiet about it.
Im not a naval guy , so i can only talk about aviation
 
为什么越南没有现代化的港口和机场，却在投资高速铁路？
我想你可能不知道，因为许多正在升级的港口实际上是军用港口或部分军事设施，政府对此保持沉默。我不是海军方面的专家，所以只能谈谈航空方面的情况。
 
About airport :
Look at AIP ( Aeronautical Information Publication ) of Viet Nam , it contain information and upxe yearly. Viet Nam AIP change extremely fast and new construction pop up everywhere. AIP contain all the information you need.
Aviation in Viet Nam is overloaded from the start.
 
关于机场问题：
可以查看越南的AIP（航空信息出版物），它包含了相关信息并且每年都会更新。越南的AIP更新非常频繁，新建设项目随处可见。AIP中包含了所有你需要的信息。
越南的航空业从一开始就处于超负荷状态。
 
The air routes via the East Sea/ South China Sea are some of the busiest airways in the world , and TSN airport is overcrowded with take off/landing cycle being as low as 1 minute.
Viet Nam invest heavily into air traffic control and airport. Though what they upgrade in specific is a secret since most airports in Viet Nam are both military and civilian facility in one.
Many airports are currently under upgrade to international airports , including Phu Quoc , Cam Ranh , Phu Bai , …etc
 
经由东海/南中国海的航线是世界上最繁忙的空中走廊之一，而新山一机场（Tan Son Nhat International Airport，TSN）因起降频次极高而异常拥挤，起降间隔最短仅为1分钟。
越南在空管系统和机场建设上投入巨大。尽管他们具体升级了哪些内容是保密的，因为越南的大多数机场都兼具军民两用功能。
目前，包括富国岛机场、金兰湾机场、富排机场在内的许多机场都在升级改造，以达到国际机场的标准。
 
ATC employ the latest technology , including navigation like RNAV , RNP and CPDLC. Within the region , Viet Nam is the fastest changing , outpacing even China and keep up with Singapore in deploying new technology into use.
China develop alot of aviation tech no doubt , but putting them into use is a whole different thing all together.
Air flow control is also in early stages of deployment and most airports/ aviation support facility ( network / radar station / land navigation equipment) are nearly done upgraded under cooperation with Japan.
 
空中交通管制（ATC）采用了最新的技术，包括RNAV（区域导航）、RNP（所需导航性能）和CPDLC（控制器与飞行员的数据链通信）。在该地区，越南的变化速度是最快的，甚至超过了中国，并与新加坡在新技术的应用上保持同步。
中国无疑开发了许多航空技术，但将这些技术投入实际使用是完全不同的事情。
空中流量控制也处于初步部署阶段，大多数机场和航空支持设施（如网络、雷达站和地面导航设备）在与日本的合作下几乎完成了升级。
 
Area Control Centre is also in planing for upgrade to support newer equipment , as well as reduce control gap ( blank area not covered by radar ).
Fun fact : Long Thanh airport , unlike most speculated , are under status quo. Why? Because VAA havent figure out away yet how that one would fit.
Vietnamese controllers have the hardest time with Indian pilots. Their english is “strange” as most controllers put it.
 
区域管制中心也在计划进行升级，以便支持新型设备，同时减少雷达覆盖不到的空白区域。
有趣的事实：与大多数人的猜测相反，龙城机场目前并没有新的进展。为什么呢？因为越南航空管理局（VAA）还没有找到合适的方案来解决这个问题。
越南的空中交通管制员在与印度飞行员沟通时遇到了最大的挑战。大多数管制员认为他们的英语听起来“很奇怪”。
 
Unci Narynin
Vietnam is investing in high speed railways? New to me. Last I checked, a proposal for a high speed line was shelved. Meanwhile they take a long time building metro systems in Hanoi and HCMC.
(If anyone has information, let me know.)
They are working on a new airport north of Ho Chi Minh City though, which will replace the current airport that is considered inadequate. Long Thanh airport is planned to be completed in 2025 and a new rail lix into the city is also being built.
 
越南正在投资建设高速铁路？这对我来说是个新消息。我上次查看时，一个高速铁路项目的提议已经被搁置。与此同时，他们在河内和胡志明市的地铁系统建设也进展缓慢。
（如果有人有最新信息，请分享给我。）
不过，他们确实正在胡志明市北部兴建一个新的机场，这个机场将替代目前被认为是不够用的现有机场。计划中，龙城机场将在2025年建成，同时，一条通往市中心的新铁路线路也在建设之中。