为什么在日本没人信仰基督教，而在韩国有更广泛的信仰？
Why Christianity is not believed in Japan whereas it is more widely believed in S.Korea?
译文简介
这是因为丰臣秀吉和德川家康驱逐传教士并取缔基督教导致的吗？
正文翻译
As the title says. Is this due to Hideyoshi and Ieyasu expelled missionaries and outlawed Christianity? I've yet to meet a single Japanese person who is a Christian. My sample size is at least 100+.
如标题所说，这是因为丰臣秀吉和德川家康驱逐传教士并取缔基督教导致的吗？我认识的人里没有哪个日本人是基督徒，样本量至少为100多。
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A big part of what the meiji reformation did was specifically in reforming shinto into an established religion that operated similarly to Christianity.
This really helped to reduce the appeal of Christianity that you were already part of a religion that was inherently tied to being Japanese.
Korean native beliefs on the other hand never really had this period of centralisation into a full formal religion.
Korea also was not quite so secluded and anti Christian as Japan in the years before modernisation so even from the early 19th century it was steadily growing there.
During the Japanese occupation Christianity became associated with being anti Japanese due to Japan's co-opting of native religion (with some success) and a lot of the educated independence leaders being Christian. The two groups became quite tied together with even apolitical Christians getting harsh treatment from the government.
明治维新的一大部分内容是将神道教改造成一种与基督教类似的宗教。
这确实降低了基督教的吸引力，因为神道教和基督教就很像了，而且与日本人的身份有着内在的联系。
韩国本土信仰则是另一种情况，他们从未真正经历过这一时期，没有将各种教派整合成一个完整的正式宗教。
在现代化之前，韩国也不像日本那样与世隔绝和反基督教，所以从19世纪早期开始，基督教就在那里稳步发展。
被日本占领期间，由于日本人指定了本土宗教（取得了一些成功），以及许多有学识的独立领袖是基督徒，使得基督教与反日联系在了一起。这两个团体的联系非常紧密，甚至连不关心政治的基督徒也受到政府的残酷对待。
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In Japan meanwhile the Post war era was far more free and democratic. The seperation of Church and state worked out quite well and so native beliefs sort of hung on as an acceptable way to keep your Japanese identity whilst still modernising. It helps that they also fit very neatly into a modern post religion society.
All said though there are a lot more Christians in Japan than people expect. Now and historically. Especially amongst the upper classes.
战后，主导韩国的独裁领袖是深受美国影响的基督徒。基督教是为了对抗日本和朝鲜的无神论而建立的。
与此同时，战后的日本要自由和民主得多，政教分离的情况相当不错，因此本土信仰作为一种可以接受的方式，既保持了日本人的身份，同时仍然现代化。这有助于他们很好地融入现代的后宗教社会。
不过尽管如此，日本的基督徒还是比人们想象的要多。不论是如今还是历史上，尤其是在上层阶级中。
The establishment of Shintoism into a systematic State religion certainly has something to do with the reduction in the appeal of Christianity in Japan, but there is also something to be said about how the existing Shinto/Buddhist religious sphere was so inherently entrenched in Japanese society, that it was difficult for people to even remain Christians in Japan.
I am sort of an unusual Japanese person, in that I do have Christians in my family tree all the way back to the late 1800s. My ancestor was said to have been converted by German and American missionaries who visited his village and built a hospital. But what I've noticed about my family is that, generally, the religiosity of each successive generation has gradually decreased. Maybe it was due to marriage with nonbelievers? Maybe it was due to assimilation into the surrounding Shinto/Buddhist religious sphere? I'm thinking that both were significant factors.
I've also noticed that female members of my family have tended to be more religiously fervent than the male members. So somehow, there has been significant gender gap in the appeal of Christianity, at least in my family. I think there is a general sense that Christianity is a feminine religion with its emphasis on love, compassion, charity, nonviolence, and not that masculine.
Church communities can be dispersed due to the small number of Christians in the country, so it's hard for many church members to come to church every Sunday, simply because the nearest church is geographically so far away. I think that also affects religious cohesion.
神道教成为体系性的国家宗教，这当然与基督教在日本的吸引力降低有关，但是，现有的神道教、佛教是如何在日本社会中根深蒂固，以至于人们连在日本继续信奉基督教都很难这事，还是有值得说道的地方。
我是一个罕见的日本人，因为我的族谱中确实有基督徒，这可以追溯到1800年代。据说我的祖先是被德国和美国的传教士传教的，他们造访了他的村庄并修建了一所医院。但我注意到，在我的家族中每一代人的信徒都在逐渐减少。也许是因为与非信徒通婚的缘故？也许是因为被周边的神道教、佛教同化的缘故？我认为两者都是重要因素。
我还注意到，我家族里的女性成员往往比男性成员更热衷于宗教。所以，至少在我的家族中，基督教的吸引力存在着明显的性别差异。我认为，存在一种普遍看法，它是强调爱、同情、慈善、非暴力的女性化宗教，而非男性化宗教。
由于日本基督徒人数较少，教会社区较分散，因此许多教会成员很难每个星期天都来教堂，因为最近的教堂太远了。我认为这也会影响宗教的凝聚力。
I think there is a general sense that Christianity is a feminine religion with its emphasis on love, compassion, charity, nonviolence, and not that masculine.
Ahh yes because being a man means being the opposite of all of those things.
(Not calling you out OP, just poking fun at completely outdated and unhelpful gender ideas).
“我认为，存在一种普遍看法，它是强调爱、同情、慈善、非暴力的女性化宗教，而非男性化宗教”
啊，是的，因为作为一个男人意味着要做这些事情的反面。
（不是在说楼上，只是在取笑这种完全过时、无益的性别观念）
Yes, it is silly indeed, but traditional conceptions of masculinity in Japan are not to be underestimated. They have been formed over hundreds of years through various influences including Buddhism, Shintoism, Bushido thought, etc. and they are still pretty influential in Japan today. In fact, one could argue that they are one of the major reasons why Japanese men have a poor impression of what they perceive Christianity is about, and why Christianity has been slow to spread in Japan.
是的，这确实很愚蠢，但日本传统的男子汉观念不容低估。它们的形成，是经过了数百年的各种影响，包括佛教、神道教、武士道思想等，而且至今在日本仍有相当大的影响力。事实上，可以这么说，这是日本男性对基督教的看法不好，以及基督教在日本传播缓慢的主要原因之一。
Being a man doesn’t have to mean being the opposite, just that women tend to have those traits more.
作为男人并不一定意味着要相反，只是女人更倾向于拥有这些特质。
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Also potentially relevant, Christianity is somewhat popular in the Nagasaki prefecture. And there was some level of conflict between missionaries and the daimyo, that resulted in the daimo ordering a bunch of christians to be crucified.
另外要注意，基督教在长崎也很受欢迎。还有，传教士和大名之间存在一定程度的冲突，导致大名下令将一群基督徒钉死在十字架上。
I know people that are part of the Shinto religion. The Shinto religion doesn’t operate anything like Christianity.
It’s more of the fact that Shinto and Buddhism is part of Japanese culture and society. This lead to the dip of Christianity in modern Japan.
我认识神道教信徒。神道教的运作方式与基督教完全不同。
更重要的是，神道教和佛教是日本文化和社会的一部分。这导致了基督教在现代日本的衰落。
Japanese Christian here. Now you know one. But I think the biggest barrier is that for Japanese people it’s hard to accept the “one true God” aspect of Christianity.
我是日本基督教徒。现在你认识一个了。但我认为最大的阻碍是，对于日本人来说，很难接受基督教的“唯一真神”观念。
You are the first one, and your explanation does make sense. Kamisama are everywhere in Japan.
你是我认识的第一个，你的解释很有道理。卡密萨玛在日本无处不在。
原创翻译：龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
I also suspect that many Japanese are more reluctant to bring up their actual religious beliefs in conversation. I mean, from my understanding you live next to someone or work with someone for years and years, and you still barely end up knowing anything about them. There seems to be a societal tendency to compartmentalize one’s own life.
我还怀疑，许多日本人更不喜欢在交谈中提及他们的真实宗教信仰。根据我的理解，比如你和某人住在一起，或者和某人一起工作了很多年，但结果你还是对他们毫无了解。似乎有一种社会趋势，将人们的生活划分开来。
Nice to make your acquaintance, I was a missionary in Japan. Another element for me is that the Bible is hard to understand for any non-believers, doubly so in Japanese. I had 2 friends in Japan tell me they read the Bible on their own but didn't understand it.
Christianity philosophically sees the past as gone and the future as coming but Buddhism sees the past, present and future as really one and the same. This makes a lot of Christian beliefs more foreign.
很高兴认识你，我是日本的传教士。在我看来，另一个因素是圣经对于任何非信徒来说都很难理解，在日语中更是如此。我在日本有两个朋友，他们告诉我说他们自己看圣经，但看不明白。
基督教在哲学上认为过去是过去，未来是未来，但佛教认为过去，现在和未来是一体的。这使得基督教信仰变得更加陌生。
Christianity in Japan is about 1 in 1000, it is considered one of the largest I unreached people groups. Isolationism is the key factor.
In the 1500-1600 most Christian’s in the country were killed and the missionary efforts didn’t begin again until post ww2.
The church is growing, but it’s a slow growth. Mustard Seed Network is the fastest growing Christian Church in the nation.
基督教徒在日本约占千分之一，被认为是最大的福音没有传达到的人群之一。孤立主义是关键因素。
在1500-1600年间，日本大多数基督徒被杀害，直到二战后，传教活动才重新开始。
教会在发展，但发展缓慢。Mustard Seed Network是日本发展最快的基督教会。
It's closer to about 1 in 100—Christians are estimated to make up between 1% and 1.5% of the population.
比例是接近百分之一——基督徒估计占人口的1%到1.5%。
I've met many Christians in Japan. When I lived in Nagasaki there were A LOT of Christians. I think the history thing has been covered, but looking up the Shimabara Rebellion might be worthwhile.
Fun fact: The largest church in East Asia was obliterated by the Fat Man atomic bomb. It was basically ground zero for the bomb. They had the original plans for the church and rebuilt it exactly the way it was, but down the road futher from it's original location.
我在日本见过许多基督徒。当我住在长崎的时候，那里有很多基督徒。我认为历史问题被掩盖了，但查查岛原起义也许能看出很多。
有趣的事实：东亚最大的教堂被原子弹“胖子”摧毁了。它基本上就在原子弹的爆心。他们对教堂有复原计划，并按照原样重建了它，但离原来的位置较远。
I don’t have the exact stat, but I’ll post later: I found out that Christianity is declining quite rapidly amongst younger people in Korea. It’s very low.
我没有确切的数据，但我发现基督教的热度在韩国年轻人中降低的速度非常快，信的人很少。
Went to Japan during Christmas time and thought it would be hard to find a Catholic church for midnight mass, because I knew Japan to be relatively secular.
圣诞节期间我去了日本，在那里很难找到一个天主教堂做午夜弥撒，因为我知道日本相对世俗。
My girlfriend is a Japanese Christian. Her whole family is also Christian, although depending on the person more or less so. She also said that as a child (and even now) she didn’t tell people she was Christian because she would be made fun of in school. She actually didn’t tell me until right before I was about to hit the kokuhaku, which scared me for a sec because I have several LGBT family members and I wouldn’t be able to date someone who doesn’t accept them. But she said she’s got no problem with them and is fairly liberal in her Christian beliefs so we’re chillin.
You can find Japanese Christians more in the historical port cities: Nagasaki, Kobe, and Yokohama.
我的女朋友是个日本基督徒，她的家人也都是基督徒。她还说，小时候（甚至到现在）她都没有告诉别人她是基督徒，因为在学校里会被取笑。她其实是在我要向她表白了才告诉我，这让我吓了一跳，因为我家人有几个是LGBT，我无法和不接受他们的人约会。但她说这对她不是问题，她的基督教信仰相当自由，所以我们很平静。
你可以在历史悠久的港口城市比如长崎、神户和横滨等找到更多的基督徒。
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I remember once during a conversation class when the topic turned to religion, one student asked me, "Who are the other Christian gods?"
我记得有一次在讨论课上，当话题转到宗教上时，有个学生问我：“基督教的其他神都有谁？”
Hey, I work with churches in Japan, so this is pretty much up my alley! There isn't one simple reason that would answer your question - it's actually a combination of history, beliefs, social structure, culture, and mindset of Japanese churches as well. I'll try to keep this brief.
Japan has been pretty isolated for most of its history. Catholic missionaries made some headway in the 16th century, but widespread belief was stunted by syncretism and persecution. There was a slight revival towards the end of the 19th century but faded during the war. Around the 1960s there was another increase, but this time there wasn't an event that decreased interest in Christianity. Many Christians from later on or the generation after that time are still a part of churches today. This is great, but the majority of churches are still largely represented by that same generation (60+).
That last point is kinda connected to the next - most Japanese Christians do not share their faith, and not enough young people are becoming Christians to prevent churches from dying out. Deciding to follow Jesus is also an individual act, which is difficult for collectivist cultures in general, but Japanese culture adds an additional layer with conformity. Being a Christian is not typical of Japanese, and for many, being a Christian means deviating from family beliefs and practices. There is also not a common spiritual ground between Christianity and popular belief. The belief in a real, personal God is foreign to most people who come from Buddhist or Shinto backgrounds. Lastly, Japanese can be suspicious of religions in general due to the country's history with cults.
嘿，我在日本的教堂工作，所以这个问题我很对口！楼主这个问题不是单一的答案能回答的——实际上是历史、信仰、社会结构、文化以及日本教会的心态的结合。我会尽量简短的来回答。
日本在其历史的大部分时间里都相当孤立。天主教传教士在16世纪取得了一些进展，但宗教的融合、对信徒的迫害导致信仰难以广泛传播。19世纪末略有进步，但在战争期间逐渐沉寂。大约在1960年代又有一次增长，这一次没有什么事件导致人们对基督教的兴趣降低了。许多之后的基督徒今天仍然是教会的一部分。这很好，但大多数教徒都是同一代人（60多岁）。
接下来的原因和上面的有点关系，大多数日本基督徒不分享他们的信仰，也没有足够的年轻人成为基督徒，去防止教会消亡。决定信仰耶稣也是一种个人行为，在集体主义文化下这很难，而日本文化还增加了一层额外的难度，就是从众。成为一名基督徒并不是日本人的常态，对许多人来说，成为一名基督徒意味着背离家庭信仰和习俗。基督教和大众信仰之间也没有共同的精神基础。对于大多数有佛教或神道教背景的人来说，信仰一个真实的、个人的上帝是陌生的。最后，由于日本的邪教历史，日本人可能对宗教持怀疑态度。
One aspect people didn't really mention in this thread:
After the Korean war, so many missionaries flooded into Korea which kickstarted Christianity in Korea. This was never the case in Japan because the country is quite closed.
在这篇帖子里，有一点大家没有提到。
朝鲜战争后，有许多传教士涌入韩国，这推动了基督教在韩国的兴起。日本从来没有这样的情况，因为这个国家相当封闭。
My family is from Kumamoto in Kyushu and are all Roman Catholics. Today they still attend mass in Tokyo and are mostly buried in a crypt attached to the Salesian Church in Meguro-ku. So while definitely a minority, Japanese Christians do exist.
我的家庭来自九州的熊本，都是罗马天主教徒。如今，他们仍在东京进行弥撒，去世的人大多埋葬在东京目黑区的慈幼会教堂地下室里。所以，虽然日本基督徒确实非常少，但确实存在。
My husband is from Nagasaki and his family is Christian. He went to church growing up. I don’t think his family is super openly Christian or anything though, and certainly not as vocal like Christians can be in other countries. They never said anything to me about Christianity even when I stayed with them for several days at a time.
I have also seen plenty of Christian churches in Tokyo. Especially Setagaya ku
我丈夫来自长崎，他的家人是基督徒。他从小一直去教堂。我不认为他的家人是非常公开的基督徒，当然也不像其他国家的基督徒那样公开表明。即使我一次和他们呆在一起几天，他们也从不跟我说关于基督教的事。
我在东京也见过很多基督教教堂。特别是在世田谷区。
There are about 1% Christians in Japan. For some reason people assume that I'm Christian because I'm white, which seems to encourage any Christians I meet to enthusiastically tell me that they are. It's awkward.
日本约有1%的人是基督徒。出于某种原因，很多人认为我是基督徒，因为我是白人，这似乎促使那些遇到我的基督徒激动的对我说他们是基督徒。好尴尬。
Catholicism WAS widespread up until Hideyoshi started the Christian purges and Tokugawa banned the religion outright and any known Christians murdered which columnated with the Shimabara rebellion while the Shogunate simultaneously getting a Dutch Christian warship to bombard the Christian rebels with threats and ultimatums during Sakoku.
天主教原本在广泛传播，直到丰臣秀吉开始对基督教进行大清洗、德川家康彻底禁止天主教、任何已知的基督徒都被杀害为止，这导致了岛原叛乱，在锁国时期，幕府派了一艘荷兰基督教军舰，对基督教叛军进行威胁和最后通牒。
There are hundreds, maybe thousands of individual churches in South Korea and these churches all act as small to large cults and social societies. Being a part of a church in Korea can open doors to jobs and financial opportunities. For example, being part of a church there and making friends people within it could find you being recommended to buy a certain property which is set to be rebuilt into an expensive apartment complex. It works out for the churchgoers because they get to be part of a special club and it works out for Pastor Kim as he gets 10% of all their income to send his kids to the States for college.
In my experience working in both wealthy and poorer areas in Korea, I barely met any religious families in the poor areas but they were all in the wealthy.
在韩国，有成百上千个独立的教堂，这些教堂都是大小不等的邪教和社会团体。成为韩国教会的一员，可以打开就业和经济机会的大门。例如，作为教会的一员，和教会里的人交朋友，可以推荐你购买某一处房产，而它即将改建为一栋昂贵的公寓楼。对于常去教堂的人来说，这是可行的，因为他们可以成为一个特殊俱乐部的一员，而对于牧师来说，这也是可行的，他可以获得成员全部收入的10%，用来把他的孩子送到美国去上大学。
以我在韩国富裕、贫困地区都有过的工作经历来看，在贫困地区我几乎没有遇到过宗教家庭，遇到过的都是富人。
I am a Japanese with part-catholic family background.
In my view Christianity is not big here because it requires much more commitment to its faith compared to other religions. My mother is from a Shinto shrine background, my father is half Buddhist (Nichiren since the Edo period) and half catholic. My grandma is a devoted catholic. I don’t have good impression on Christianity as my grandma forced all of the rest of the family to baptize and relinquish other faith. Everyone rejected that but my father baptized while maintaining nichiren faith as our grave is being maintained by the temple. I think in that sense, Christianity, due to its monotheistic nature is a very xenophobic religion as they do not accept other deities as sacred. Most of us don’t like that. I also have friends who studies at catholic university but they tend to be very nationalistic. One guy who went to Jakarta with me said Japanese are the most westernized Asian country so we are the most superior and morally correct nation. I was like ((wut??)) for the whole time. My grandma was like that too. They like to think there are universal value and that they themselves are at the center of that. State Shintoism was something like that but such ideas seem to survive in Japanese catholic community which made me very uncomfortable. Modern shrine Shinto and most traditional Buddhism nowadays are more like “we don’t care about others so do as you like” attitude. They don’t care if they actively participate in the faith. They are like “just come when you feel like you want to”, which is in good terms with modern lifestyle. I can’t imagine a life which I have to go to church every Sunday as my grandma does.
我是个日本人，家庭有部分天主教背景。
在我看来，基督教在日本规模不大，因为与其他宗教相比，它需要更多的奉献。我的母亲是神社出身，我的父亲一半是佛教徒(从江户时代开始的日莲宗)
一半是天主教徒。我奶奶是虔诚的天主教徒。我对基督教印象不好，因为我奶奶强迫家里人接受洗礼并放弃其他信仰。所有人都拒绝了，但我父亲接受了洗礼但同时保持了日莲宗的信仰，因为我们家的坟墓是由寺庙维护的。我认为在这方面，基督教由于其一神论的本质是一个非常排外的宗教，因为他们不接受其他神是神圣的。我们大多数人都不喜欢这点。我也有在天主教大学学习的朋友，但他们往往很民族主义。一个和我一起去雅加达的人说，日本是最西化的亚洲国家，所以我们是最优秀、道德上最正确的国家。我全程一脸懵逼。我奶奶也是这样。他们喜欢认为普世价值是存在的，他们自己就是普世价值的中心。神道教也有点类似的想法，但这样的想法在日本天主教社区中仍然存在，这让我很不舒服。现代神道教和如今大多数传统佛教更像是“我们不在乎别人怎么样，你爱怎么做就怎么做”。 他们不在乎是否积极践行信仰。它们的态度是“想来就来”， 这与现代生活方式很相称。我无法想象像我奶奶那样每个星期天都要去教堂的生活。
Why should it be common though? There is only Philippines in asia with significant Christian population .
基督教为什么应该普遍？亚洲只有菲律宾才有很多基督徒。
About 30% of South Korea is Christian.
韩国人大约30%的是基督徒。
After the cessation of fighting during the Korean War evangelical Christian missionaries flooded into South Korea and went to work converting as many people as they could. That's why there are so many evangelical Christians in South Korea and why anti-gay discrimination and violence is a big problem there. Thank God Christianity never got a foothold in Japan.
在朝鲜战争战斗停止后，福音派基督教的传教士涌入韩国，开始尽可能多地传教。这就是韩国有这么多福音派基督徒的原因，以及反同性恋歧视和暴力在那里是个大问题的原因。谢天谢地，基督教从未在日本立足。
Christianity was big in Korea before the war, in fact a lot of the opposition to Japanese rule was from the christians in Korea in part because Japan wasn't exactly big on letting churches challenge their colonial power. A bit of trivia Kim Il-Sung's parents were Christians, his grandfather was a preacher.
朝鲜基督教在战前的规模就很大了，事实上，很多反对日本统治的人都是韩国的基督徒，部分原因是日本不愿意让教会挑战他们的殖民统治。金日成的父母是基督教徒，他的祖父是传教士。
One of the great things of Japan
这是日本最好的事情之一。
原创翻译：龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
I actually agree with this. I am 100% against religious and cultural colonialization. One thing amazing about Japan is that it left its religion and culture in tack without outside (western) influences.
Korea always baffles me with its strong Christian/Catholic connection. Its just odd to see a tradition Korean house with a Cross inside it.
我同意这一点。我非常反对宗教和文化殖民。日本令人惊讶的一点是，它没有受到外部（西方）影响，保持了自己的宗教和文化。
韩国与基督教、天主教的紧密联系让我感到困惑。看到传统的韩国房子里面有十字架，真是奇怪。