QA：法国人对戴高乐有何看法？
How did the French feel about Charles de Gaulle?
译文简介
多年来，法国人与戴高乐的关系一直发生着很大的变化。
正文翻译
How did the French feel about Charles de Gaulle?
法国人对戴高乐有何看法？
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For the past 70 years have lived on and off in France
The relationship between the French and de Gaulle has changed quite a lot over the years.
In June 1940 the French army was no longer in a position to resist the invaders and Pétain signed with the Germans an armistice. The lonely little known two star general de Gaulle left for London to continue the war. At that time the French were happy to be out of the hostilities and de Gaulle was generally considered a traitor by most French.
As the war kept continuing, with food rationing and later young Frenchmen forced to work in Germany, more and more people listened to the London radio, and for quite a few de Gaulle represented HOPE. However the French majority kept sitting on a fence waiting for the issue of the war.
When the Allies landed in Normandy in June 1944, suddenly the popularity of de Gaulle enjoyed an IMMENSE ASCENT. De Gaulle made a speech in Bayeux and the obvious welcome by the French was so unanimous that the Allies had to accept him as the sole authority of the land and forget about installing an alternative military regime.
在过去的 70 年里断断续续地生活在法国
多年来，法国人与戴高乐的关系一直发生着很大的变化。
1940 年 6 月，法国军队无法抵抗侵略者，贝当与德国人签署了停战协议。孤独的鲜为人知的二星将军戴高乐前往伦敦继续战争。当时法国人很高兴摆脱了敌对行动，戴高乐被大多数法国人普遍认为是叛徒。
随着战争继续进行，粮食配给以及后来的法国年轻人被迫给德国工作，越来越多的人收听伦敦广播，对不少人来说，戴高乐代表着希望。然而，大多数法国人一直在观望，等待战争的结束。
当盟军于 1944 年 6 月在诺曼底登陆时，戴高乐的知名度突然大幅上升。戴高乐在贝叶发表了讲话，显然受到了法国人的一致欢迎，以至于盟军不得不接受他作为这片土地的唯一权威，而忘记了建立一个替代军事政权。
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The Algerian war and the threat of a military putsch in 1958 gave him a second chance to seize the helm of the power…and this time he did not let the events determine his agenda. While he put an unsatisfactory end to that war, he gave France a half presidential half parliamentary regime, called the 5th Republic and became the immensely popular President intent to restore France to its rank as a Great power. His periodic press conferences were almost a religious affair with his Ministers and the press receiving with respect (and some boredom) the messages of the Great Man.
1946 年，也就是仅仅两年后，法国人不顾戴高乐的反对，通过了一部宪法，戴高乐认为它赋予了政党太多的权力。戴高乐想要一部不同的宪法并辞职了。他离开了，大家本以为这是一次短暂的流放，但最终持续了 12 年，他成为一个半被遗忘的退休的英雄，法国人认为他属于历史，没有机会卷土重来。
阿尔及利亚战争和 1958 年军事政变的威胁给了他第二次掌权的机会……而这一次他没有让事件决定他的议程。虽然他结束那场战争的方式并不令人满意，但他给了法国一个半总统半议会的政权，称为第五共和国，并成为极受欢迎的总统，意图使法国恢复大国地位。他定期举行的新闻发布会几乎是一场宗教活动，他的部长们和新闻界都以尊重（以及一些厌烦）的态度接收这位伟人的信息。
One year later in April 1969 de Gaulle organized a referendum, basically to prove his continued popularity. With a majority of a million votes the French rejected de Gaulle’s project and the General resigned and left for what he knew to be his final exile.
A sulking de Gaulle, bitter against his successor Pompidou, whom he considered responsible for his final rejection , bitter against the French people whom he considered ungrateful, he did not try to hide his resentments. He went on vacation while Pompidou ascended to the Presidency, he ostensibly paid a visit to Franco whom the French despised and a year later died an angry old man.
1968 年 5 月，青年起义。到现在为止，这位 78 岁的老人已经不适应法国人的情绪了——事实证明，他也完全无法应对这场反抗。青年高呼“戴高乐再见，再见”。幸运的是，他的总理蓬皮杜完美地处理了这个情况，并犯下了击败他的主人的不可原谅的罪行。戴高乐解雇了他的总理，并认为自己可以与法国保持持续的联系。
一年后的 1969 年 4 月，戴高乐组织了一次公投，主要是为了证明他的仍然受欢迎的程度。法国人以一百万票的多数票否决了戴高乐的计划，戴高乐将军辞职并开始了他最后一次自我流放。
生闷气的戴高乐，对他的继任者蓬皮杜怀恨在心，他认为蓬皮杜对他最终被法国人民拒绝负有责任，他也对他认为忘恩负义的法国人民怀恨在心，他并没有试图掩饰自己的怨恨。他去度假，而蓬皮杜登上总统宝座，他表面上拜访了法国人鄙视的佛朗哥，一年后，他作为一位愤怒的老人去世。
In 1981 Mitterrand was elected President. The man had opposed de Gaulle all during his long political career, and he definitely claimed to escape the shadow of the General. For the French de Gaulle’s epoch appeared obsolete, people aspired to shorter working hours and more social justice not Grandeur de la France.
For the contemporary French de Gaulle is part of the country’s history, somewhere between Joan of Arc and Louis XIV …not forgotten but not much remembered either.
12 年来，在他的两位继任者蓬皮杜和季斯卡尔·戴高乐的右翼统治下，一个强大的“戴高乐党”声称受到戴高乐愿景的启发，戴高乐在公众眼中成为某种偶像，深受尊重，而法国则接受了成为一个中等规模的力量的定位。
1981年，密特朗当选为总统。这个人在他漫长的政治生涯中一直反对戴高乐，他明确声称要摆脱戴高乐将军的阴影。因为法国戴高乐的时代似乎已经过时，人们渴望更短的工作时间和更多的社会正义，而不是伟大的法兰西。
因为当代的法国，戴高乐是该国历史的一部分，介于圣女贞德和路易十四之间……没有被遗忘，但也没有多少人记得。
Not a very accurate comment.
Today De Gaulle is immensely popular, and this among all parties. Even Mitterrand, his most fierce opponent, avoid criticizing him while in power.
“suddenly the popularity of de Gaulle enjoyed an IMMENSE ASCENT”
Did you believe in magic? De Gaulle was known by all French before the landing and represented theirs only hopes. He was leading the unified French resistance since 1943, called FFI, and French troops fighting in Italy called FFL.
Please don’t speak on the behalf of the French people.
不是很准确的评论。
今天，戴高乐非常受欢迎，而且在所有政党中都是如此。即使是他最凶猛的对手密特朗，在掌权期间也避免批评他。
“突然之间，戴高乐的知名度急剧上升”
你相信魔法吗？戴高乐在登陆前就为所有法国人所熟知，因为他代表了他们唯一的希望。自 1943 年以来，他一直领导法国统一抵抗运动，称为 FFI，而在意大利作战的法国军队称为 FFL。
请不要代表法国人民发言。
You are more than welcome to give a different, no doubt better answer to this question. I only interrogated my daughter and my grand-daughter about their and their friends’ opinion and the answer was : Our generation does not give a damn.
我们非常欢迎你对这个问题给出不同的、无疑是更好的答案。我只询问了我的女儿和我的孙女他们和他们的朋友的意见，答案是：我们这一代人根本不在乎（戴高乐）。
The reason behind the May 1968 “riots” (not even one dead student) were not at all directed against de Gaulle but were a partly aborted revolution (I was 18 years old then and studying in Nanterre, one of the two most excited universities).
It was a period of full employment and the youth were discovering the contraception pill and an unprecedented sexual freedom and the need to be heroes in the eyes of the girls. They also rejected their parents heavy working during the “30 glorieuses” (30 glorious days of post war reconstruction). We were unconsciously craving for the Front Populaire holidays and materialistically carefree and joyful happiness (the hippies in America had, differently, the same aspirations)
1968年5月的"暴动"（甚至没有一个学生死亡）背后的原因根本不是针对戴高乐，而是一场部分流产的革命（当时我18岁，在南泰尔学习，那是这期间两所最活跃的大学之一）。
那是一个充分就业的时期，年轻人发现了避孕药和前所未有的性自由，以及在女孩眼中成为英雄的需要。他们也拒绝像他们的父母在"30个光荣日"（战后重建的30个光荣日）期间那样繁重的工作。我们不自觉地渴望"人民阵线"提出的假期，渴望物质上的无忧无虑和快乐的幸福（美国的嬉皮士也有同样的愿望，不尽相同）。
There are some elements of truth in your statement but it’s not the yoyo you describe. It is more the fight of the short term materialistic advantages requested by the students against the long term economic adaptation of France sought after by de Gaulle and Pompidou, impacted by the sexual revolution in the world (which positively revolutionized the world music more than the national economies)
戴高乐想把法国的管理权下放，而法国左翼利用我们不成熟的渴望投了反对票，结果戴高乐觉得自己的政策没有得到支持，就像他说的那样辞职了。但在这之前，5月30日有100万人在香榭丽舍大街平静地示威，支持戴高乐当总统（不是支持蓬皮杜，蓬皮杜无可争议地在8月的学生假期结束后，在9月很好地解决了危机），这个人数远远超过骚乱的学生。
你的说法中有一些真实的成分，但结论不是你所描述的那样。更多的是学生受到世界上性革命的影响，要求短期物质利益与戴高乐和蓬皮杜追求法国长期经济适应的斗争（这次革命对世界音乐的积极性超过了对国家经济）。
You were in excellent position to form your own judgement. I was over 30 so much less inolved
你有很好的条件来形成你自己的判断。我当时已经过了30岁，所以参与度要低得多
This posting makes the French look very self absorbed and opportunistic. When it was easier to go along with a Vichy France, they took that route. When the Allies were likely to win, they swung that way. I'm sure there were resistance people from the beginning, but I wonder if the majority of the population just took the easiest, less problematic path???
这个帖子让法国人看起来非常自我和机会主义。当顺着维希法国走比较容易的时候，他们就走了这条路。当盟军有可能获胜时，他们就转向了盟军。我相信从一开始就有反抗的人，但我想知道大多数人是否只是走了最容易、遇到的问题较少的道路？
There is no unanimity about this delicate question. One million people welcomed Pétain at his only visit to Paris, and less than one year later the same number turned out for de Gaulle
在这个微妙的问题上没有一致的意见。贝当唯一一次访问巴黎时，有一百万人欢迎他，而不到一年后，同样多的人参加了戴高乐的活动。
The Americans and Brits supported De Gaulle because (1) he was a popular war hero and (2) he was not Communist.
I have no belief in Communism, but it’s a fact that much of the French Resistance was driven by that group. De Gaulle was a war hero who had no part of Communism, so the Western Allies put up with him.
美国人和英国人支持戴高乐是因为（1）他是一个受欢迎的战争英雄，（2）他不是共产党。
我不相信共产主义，但法国抵抗运动的大部分是由该组织推动的，这是一个事实。戴高乐是一个与共产主义没什么关系的战争英雄，所以西方盟国容忍了他。
I don't agree with this assessment and I hasten to add that personally I was on the side of the rioters in 1968, as a boy. He had a profound impact on the country and performed a great service to France during and in the immediate aftermath of WW2. He also eventually did the right thing in 1962, and that was not easy. Maybe the execution of the Evian accords should have been better. He is highly regarded in France and the country still is largely the result of what he put in motion. The Vth Republic was De Gaulle. In my view its a masterpiece and is the reason we don't have the far right in power. That said , personally I was always against the ‘Mon General’ view of life but his achievements in difficult circumstances and long lasting impact were remarkable.
我不同意（主贴）这种评价，我不得不补充，就我个人而言，我在1968年是站在暴乱者一边的，当时还是个孩子。他对国家产生了深远的影响，并在二战期间和二战结束后立即为法国做出了巨大贡献。他也最终在1962年做了正确的事情，这并不容易。也许《埃维昂协议》的执行情况应该更好。他在法国受到高度评价，这个国家在很大程度上仍然是他推动的结果。第五共和国是戴高乐的。在我看来，这是一个杰作，也是我们没有极右派掌权的原因。话虽如此，我个人一直反对"mon général"的人生观，但他在困难的环境中取得的成就和长期的影响是显著的。
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That's a quality post. I would just like to contrast it with mine, by bringing a few more nuances :
De Gaulle became extremely controversial on the Algeria topic. He gave up Algeria after having promised to fight to keep it under the french flag. It led to assassination attempts and a military insurgency of the french armed forces.
In 1968, the youth opposed De Gaulle mainly because the youth was retarded. 1968’s riots was a time of social reforms, by some extent, it's generally remembered nowadays has the landmark for the moral decline of France.
Finally, De Gaulle is nonetheless a modern mythical figure in today's France. He's still said to be the best president of the fifth republic to this date.
这是个高质量的帖子。我只想通过带来更多细微差别来将它与我的观点进行对比：
戴高乐在阿尔及利亚问题上极富争议性。他在承诺要为把阿尔及利亚留在法国国旗下而战斗之后，放弃了阿尔及利亚。这导致了暗杀企图和法国武装部队的军事叛乱。
1968年，青年们反对戴高乐，主要是因为青年们很弱智。1968年的骚乱处于一个社会改革的时期，在某种程度上，现在人们普遍将其称为是法国道德滑坡的标志性事件。
最后，戴高乐在今天的法国仍然是一个现代的神话人物。他至今仍被认为是第五共和国的最佳总统。
原创翻译：龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
Originally Answered: What is your opinion of C. de Gaulle?
Two charlatans from the CIA are able to tour Europe recruiting local security officials under the pretext that they have inside knowledge that the civilian government is riddled with Soviet spies.
They convince MI5 that Prime Minister Wilson is a Soviet agent and have similar luck elsewhere. They get to France. de Gaulle throws them out of France together with the US military bases together with NATO.
In 1968 student revolutionaries are fomenting revolt all over the world and in particular in Paris. De Gaulle plays the role of national wise old grandfather and the children go home.
In Algeria there is incipient civil war. De Gaulle arrives, stands on a balcony and declares "I have understood you!" and everyone applauds and the crisis goes away.
With no army and no country he bluffs his way into international meetings of Stalin, Churchill and FDR as an equal.
Class act.
两名来自中央情报局的江湖骗子能够在欧洲招募当地安全官员，借口是他们知道官僚系统里充斥着苏联间谍。
他们让军情五处相信了威尔逊总理是一名苏联特工，并且在其他地方也有类似的运气。他们到了法国，戴高乐把他们和美国的军事基地以及北约一起赶出了法国。
1968年，学生革命者在世界各地，特别是在巴黎煽动起义。戴高乐扮演了国家明智的老爷爷的角色，让孩子们都回家了。
在阿尔及利亚，内战一触即发。戴高乐来到这里，站在阳台上宣布："我已经理解你们的诉求了！"大家鼓掌，危机消失了。
在没有军队和国家撑腰的情况下，他以平等的身份在斯大林、丘吉尔和罗斯福的国际会议上虚张声势。
出类拔萃。
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Charles de Gaulle was a man who believed in his destiny to become the President of a free France. Un-wavering in his patriotic duty he epitomised the glory that was his homeland. He was a pain in the butt for the Americans, And, he was a bigger pain in the butt for we Brits’ when we kept knocking on the door to be let in to the ‘common market’. In hindsight, perhaps we should have known then, all those years ago, that De Gaulle was right to say Non, Non, to Britain’s inclusion into the early Euro economic zone. He knew that we Brits were going to be a square peg in a round hole. He was also aware that he would be vilified in the British media for his anti-British stance, But he had more than enough Gallic natural arrogance not to allow his feelings to be hurt by the perfidy of Albion. He saw the two great European powers of France and a democratic Germany becoming the main players in what would eventually become the European superstate — and he did not foresee the UK as being part of it. Not trusting the Anglo-sphere! He had enormous problems bringing France from its colonial past in to the modern world. Vietnam and Algeria were draining the Republic’s resources beyond breaking point. But, like Napoleon, de Gaulle had that quality of leadership that pulled a nation through those dark days of soul searching. Perhaps, that was the man’s finest hour. Not just the commander in chief of The Free French Forces based in the UK in WW2. Like him or not, Charles de Gaulle should be remembered as a true French Patriot — not just by the French people, but by we British, too!
夏尔-戴高乐是一个坚信自己注定要成为自由法国总统的人。他坚定不移地履行爱国职责，彰显了祖国的荣耀。他是美国人的眼中钉，也是我们英国人的眼中钉，因为我们一直在敲门要求加入"共同市场"。事后看来，也许我们当时就应该知道，这么多年来，戴高乐对英国加入早期欧元经济区说"不"是正确的。他知道，我们英国人将成为一个圆孔中的方钉。他也知道他的反英立场会被英国媒体诋毁，但他带着足够的高卢人天生的傲慢，不允许自己的感情被阿尔比恩的背叛所伤害。他预见到法国和民主德国这两个欧洲大国最终将成为欧洲超级国家的主要参与者--他不认为英国会成为其中的一部分。他不信任盎格鲁圈子！他在将法国从过去的殖民时代带入现代世界时遇到了巨大的问题。越南和阿尔及利亚正在耗费共和国的资源，使其处于崩溃边缘。但是，就像拿破仑一样，戴高乐具有那种领导力的品质，能把一个国家从那些深入骨髓的黑暗日子里拉出来。也许，那才是这个人最辉煌的时刻。而不仅仅是二战中驻扎在英国的自由法国部队的总司令。不管你喜不喜欢，夏尔·戴高乐都应该作为真正的法国爱国者而被铭记——不仅是法国人民，还有我们英国人！
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Charles de Gaulle a good man ? NO . He was obsessed with France’s grandeur and also his own grandeur FULL STOP.
Personal integrity he pursued almost to comical length. Once a year he would invite to the Elysée Palace all his grand-children, nephews for an afternoon chocolate +cakes and he insisted on paying for the costs from his own purse. His vacation home “La Boissonnière” where he retired to rest (or to die) was purchased when he was still a young officer and he paid for it by taking out a long mortgage.
Friends he did not have. With Malraux they had a mutual respect as lovers of the French language …other relationships with “equals” are not known even from his years as up and coming officer.
夏尔-戴高乐总体上是个好人吗？
夏尔-戴高乐是个好人吗？不。他沉迷于法国的宏伟过往，也沉迷于他自己的光辉岁月。
他对个人诚信的追求几乎到了可笑的地步。每年他都会邀请他所有的孙子、侄子到爱丽舍宫吃下午巧克力+蛋糕，他坚持要自己掏腰包支付费用。他的度假屋“La Boissonnière”是他退休后休息（或死去）的地方，这是他还是一名年轻军官时买下的，他通过长期抵押贷款支付了这笔费用。
他没有朋友。与马尔罗一起，他们作为法语爱好者相互尊重......至于有没有其他"平等"的关系则不为人知，即使在他作为新晋军官的年代也是如此。
Reluctant to pardon Maréchal Pétain and Général Jouhaud. After WW2 quite a few leaders of the Vichy or collaborator regimes were executed and Pétain was also condemned to death. Everybody expected de Gaulle to pardon him, as the two men knew quite well each other and de Gaulle’s early career was fostered by the victor of Verdun. De Gaulle initially insisted on the sentence to be carried out, saying “he would not have hesitated having me shot, if the circumstances had allowed him”. He relented when he realised that the old marshal still benefited from a lot good-will amongst the population, but he made sure that the conditions of his imprisonment were quite harsh …Franco sent the man some fresh fruit that wasn’t on the prisoner’s usual diet…
Général Jouhaud was amongst the 4 generals who attempted a putsch against Paris when it became obvious that France and de Gaulle were no longer willing to continue a colonial war that appeared hopeless and earned the disapproval of most of the UN. Jouhaud was condemned to death and narrowly escaped execution due to the intervention of practically all important ministers of de Gaulle’s government.
无情。当他险些被隐藏的枪手杀死时，他坚决要求组织这起事件的人被行刑队处决。虽然巴斯蒂安-蒂里是出于真诚的政治信念行事，但相信“法国阿尔及利亚”的戴高乐却鄙视他。“他组织了这次尝试，却让其他受雇的人来了一次糟糕的射击！”。他不仅拒绝赦免他，还在最高法院审理他的上诉之前将他处死。
不愿赦免贝当将军和朱豪将军。二战后，维希政权或合作者政权的不少领导人被处决，贝当也被判处死刑。大家都期待戴高乐能赦免他，因为这两个人彼此相当熟悉，而且戴高乐的早期职业生涯是由这位凡尔登战役的胜利者培养起来的。戴高乐最初坚持要执行判决，说"如果情况倒过来，他也会毫不犹豫地把我枪毙"。当他意识到这位老元帅仍然受到民众的许多善意时，他心软了，但他确保贝当的监禁条件相当苛刻......佛朗哥给这个人送去了一些新鲜的水果，显然这不在这位囚犯日常的食谱上......
当法国和戴高乐显然不再愿意继续一场看似无望并受到联合国大部分成员反对的殖民战争时，茹奥将军是试图对巴黎发动政变的 4 名将军之一。茹奥被判处死刑，不过在戴高乐政府几乎所有重要部长的干预下，只是险些被处决。
The French were in his opinion unworthy of the land he dearly loved, fairy princess France. When he was rejected by a majority of his compatriots at the end of his tenure, the 79 year old ex-monarch wanted to show his contempt towards all the French by travelling to meet the old dictator Franco, whom all the French detested. See my answer to : How did De Gaulle die?
Conclusion. De Gaulle was no saint, just a human with a very large ambition.
无非是一场小争吵：1968 年，事实证明，他的总理乔治·蓬皮杜比他更适合处理学生起义造成的危机。事情一平静下来，戴高乐就解雇了他，取而代之的是一位专长仅限于外交事务的人……几个月后，整个巴黎都充斥着毫无根据的谣言，称蓬皮杜夫人与一位不以贞操闻名女士娜塔莉·德龙有染……蓬皮杜要求戴高乐平息谣言，但总统无视了这一要求。当蓬皮杜当选并成为"大查尔斯"的继任者时，戴高乐生气地去度假了，以便在这位在他看来"配不上"的继任者就职时不在场。
在他看来，法国人配不上这片他深爱的土地--法兰西仙女。当他在任期结束时被大多数同胞拒绝时，这位79岁的前君主想通过旅行去见所有法国人都讨厌的老独裁者佛朗哥来显示他对所有法国人的蔑视。
结论：戴高乐不是圣人，只是一个有着巨大抱负的人。